"The immigrant demonstrators who flooded the streets of America’s cities Monday ratcheted up pressure on lawmakers to complete an overhaul of the nation’s immigration laws, while raising Republicans’ frustration with President Bush for what they see as a muddled stand on the issue." Weisman
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I have decided to venture into untested waters (for me.) I suppose that Mr. Weisman is the "child of immigrants." Me too, partly. On the basis of my Tiger Woods like patrimony of French/Scottish/Irish/Huron/German genes I refuse to be anything in particular other than difficult. Us Hurons reserve the right to say who has the right to be here.
The immigration thing is vaguely unsettling. I do not think there are many citizens in this country who advocate shipping the illegal aliens – There, I Said IT- back to bongo-land or lower Oaxaca, whichever they came from, but there are a good many of us who do object to said "undocumented workers," BS! They are ILLEGAL ALIENS!! telling us that they are citizens of the world or the Americas and therefore not only have as much right to be here as we citizens (including Hurons) and that there should be no borders at all.
Wait a minute! That might be a good thing. Tell you what. As an experiment in the abolition of the state system in world organization, let’s open the border with Mexico completely to all economic and residential activity.
Under this scheme, Mexicans could come live in the US, work here, own whatever they please (and can pay for) but they could not become citizens entitled to a vote unless they go through the process of legal immigration and naturalization under our laws complete with application for an immigrant visa, a Green Card and the ability to tell the judge who Millard Fillmore was and what the 13th Amendment meant. We would also change our rules so that the children of non-citizen resident workers would not automatically be US persons. Happy? Arriba Mexico!
In return we Gringos and associated US Citizens would have the identical rights in Mexico. We could live there as often and for as long as we want. We could own any property, business, mines, railroads, utilities, petroleum deposits and extraction facilities that we can pay for. We would have the right to re-patriate 100% of our profits and pay the same taxes as Mexican citizens. In other words, we would shortly largely own the economy of Mexico as we did before the Mexican Revolution and the forced nationalizations of the barefoot Marxists "ripped us off."
No? Why not? Fair is fair. Turn about is fair play. I would love this. I speak Spanish, love Mexican food and art and would buy a hacienda by the sea where the Mariachi guys could sing "La Paloma" and "Nosotros" in the evenings on the patio.
What a good deal this would be for everyone.
Pat Lang
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2002923934_immigcongress11.html
Something for consideration by those Right Wing Christians who might be in uproar over immigrants:
As written in Leviticus 19:33-34, “When an alien lives with you in your land, do not mistreat him. THE ALIEN LIVING WITH YOU MUST BE TREATED AS ONE OF YOUR NATIVE BORN. Love him as yourself…” No mention of “illegal or legal” status–Looks like Medicaid, schools, etc are to be provided.
As an agnostic I do not necessarily hold to such verse, but gladly point such out to those Bible thumpers who hang on every word.
This whole debate is about the wrong subject. There is such a disparity, and increasingly so, between wages in the US and Mexico, no amount of fences, deportations, or anything else short of automatic weapons fire (and we’re running out of bullets because of Iraq) or minefields is going to have much effect.
Why? Because of our nation’s stupid economic policies which allow multinational corporations to rape and pillage nations’ economies at will. NAFTA was/is a disaster which also surrendered our national economic sovereignty. But you’ll never hear Tancredo or the other wingnuts mention this subject.
As for being “illegal”, which immigrants from Europe had visas to come here originally? Not many Native Americans issued them.
Charlie
That’s what I say, kemo sabe. Which tribe do you belong to?
BS. They are in this country illegally. Do we not have a right to borders? pl
Al
Sanctimonious.
pl
Col. Perfect. I could not agree with you more.
There is a legal process to immigrate to the US. And all prospective immigrants should follow the law as many millions do. If our farms and restaurants want to hire immigrants and the legal process is inadequate lets change the laws. But rewarding law breaking wether it is a US business that hires illegals or illegals demanding legal status does not make sense. Offering citizenship to US born children of illegals again is the wrong message. This position is not about xenophobia although there are some who are in the anti-immigrant camp. All Americans after all are descendants of immigrants and we have a long history of immigration.
However, Col, your idea is brilliant. Since we are so keen on promoting globalization lets start with a free flow zone as you suggest with Mexico and Canada. Maybe then with US capital and ownership many folks south of the border would not need to cross the border for economic reasons.
Pat, we gringos, the last time I looked were trillions in debt as a country and billions in debt as a people and government…in others words we can’t afford to buy anything…not Mexico , not anything…we are a country in decline with uncontrollable deficeits and trillions in obigations Medicare and Social Security obligations no one wants to face. The “gringo” thing is over. In the next century it could all be over Michael Singer
Not bad (but why stop at Mexico?). While making modest proposals, let us also legalize the drug economy and so trade away that other security problem at the border!
“Fair is fair. Turn about is fair play.”
There are many people around the world, governments included, that increasingly seek to apply the above enunciated standard to other areas of international relations.
Be careful for what u wish for.
M
Personally, the maxim “good fences make good neighbors” rings true to me.
It’s axiomatic that sovereign nations unreservedly have the authority to police their borders in any reasonable manner, including, but not limited to physical barriers. If, as the administration states, we face an enemy with the specific intent of acquiring WMD and using them within the territory of the US, then prudence dictates at a minimum the maintenance of some type of security fence on both the southern and northern borders.
M
Mac,
You must be a political scientist. Irony, man, irony. pl
Eric
Sounds like a Swift idea. pl
Mike
You are absolutely right. we are headed for the dung heap of history.
Someone should tell these folks that they are trying to stow away on a sinking ship.
“Nosotros que nos queremos tanto debenos separar nos. No me preguntas mas…” or something like that. pl
Zanzibar
I don’t know about Canadia. One must have SOME standards. pl
No – but I’m an expert diaper changing, bottle feeding stay-at-home Dad, awaiting Bar results who did a brief stint in DC for Voice Of America, Farsi Service.
Go Redskins
Ha … a northern fence! đ Sorry, it’s just not feasible to have a fence that’s 4500 miles wide. There are numerous islands where the two borders meet.
A fence isn’t an answer.
—-
Almost every time the subject comes up, borders are tightened up.
Where is the legislation that documents workers? Where are the high fines to employers and companies that employ them? Where is there a procedure for farm workers to come into your country and exit when their time is up?
I get really tired of seeing Canada included illegal immigration comes into the United States well south of our borders. There are no people swimming across the Great Lakes or great hordes of people coming across the unmanned borders that divide the two countries. Visas have to be obtained for people to enter Canada. There is a programme for workers from other countries to enter. They are paid fair wages and usually they leave when their work permit expires. The number that stay is quite small.
I really donât mind having to get a passport in January 2007. Almost every country we go to, passports are necessary. Will having to get a passport hurt tourism and trade? It probably will for a short period, then citizens from each side of the border will adjust and ensure they have passports for travel. I expect there will be a reduction in snow birds who go to Florida and other warm States. Themâs the breaks! At the rate global warming is happening, people just may come up from Southern States in the future to partake of our colder climate âtil it gets unbearably hot here too! đ
If illegal immigration didnât profit from it continuing, it would stop. Fix the infrastructure and the number of illegals will become manageable.
How big were you thinking of building a fence? If it’s 10′ high, there are 12′ ladders.
Yes – it’s more than a bit impractical – but if there’s an enemy as the one we’ve been led to believe, then somethings gotta give – the borders just cannot be left as unprotected as they apparently are. Of course, I have no personal knowledge of either border. I should probably give it a rest and go back to changing diapers.
M
Enemies…you mean terrorists? A super police force such as the world has never seen before would have more effect than trading bullets around the world. Or strategic killing of them as they are discovered in their cells would be effective.
Terrorism is a clandestine activity and needs to be treated as such.
Citizens shouldn’t have to trade their civil rights to catch them.
Agreed – “Citizens shouldn’t have to trade their civil rights to catch them.”
The thing is, OBL et al, are very patient and doggedly determined, and have been immeasurably stregthened by many of the crass moves of the present government. We have a duty to do all that can be reasonably done to protect ourselves, starting perhaps with a change in the way we conduct our MidEast relations, but that appears too taboo of a subject to broach – let’s at least hunker down then within a Fortress America and hope for the best. But I’d agree the better solution lies beyond our borders, whatever their shape or form maybe.
M
I found an article that was in line with what I had suggested earlier about immigration:
Immigration
âThe current official policy of hotly pursuing migrants on the border and then ignoring them once theyâve been given a minimum wage job works for nobody. Immigrant workers should certainly be legalized, but in return there must be strict work site enforcement. Accepting and supporting a verification system at the point of employment must accompany supporting a channel for legal immigration. This would not only uphold the law but would also serve to protect immigrant workers from all the sorts of exploitation they currently experience.â
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Bunker mentalities about closing borders, shutting yourself in? Isolationary tactics?
The world is a lot smaller now. Economies and people are interconnected with each other. International co-operation between countries will result in terrorists being caught. Sealing yourself in won’t assist America–reaching out might?
I’m a hopeless optimist and know the world will be a better place. Almost everyone in this universe strives for freedom. It’s a voice that’s built it to people regardless of colour and it’s not limited by geography or the type of governance in countries.
From peasants to educated philosophers…the movement has always been toward freedom and that part of mankind remains fixed within each of us.
The plaque at the base of the Statue of Liberty says, “Give me your huddle masses …”
People will risk their lives and die in the pursuant to come to your country because it’s seen as embracing freedom. That’s why Mexicans are so attracted to the United States.
Sorry about my spelling errors.
Here’s that poem by Emma Lazzarus graven on the tablet at the base of the beautiful Statue of Liberty:
The New Colossus
“Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand
Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.
“Keep ancient lands, your storied pomp!” cries she
With silent lips. “Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!”
Statue of Liberty
Didn’t the barbarians start pouring across the the Danube at the end of western empire?
The downside to decency and high mindedness: Canadians scoff at fences when they should be building walls.
Your idea would extend to Mexico-US the same arrangement that we have as members of the Union European . We go one further here in France, from whence came your Statue of Liberty by the way, and allow Union European members from other countries to vote in our city elections if they are residents of the city.
Citizenship, as you suggest, is another matter and varies from country to country.
Will
Wilfred, perhaps?
I had not thought of my modest proposal in terms of the EU but that is interesting. pl
Since Addled and Muddled is my mental default position, I should probably apply for permanent residence status on this thread.
I have employed Mexicans in my business for 20 years, and worked for a brief period as a farm labor contractor.
From what I observe in NW Virginia, most illegals are nowâand have been for some timeâworking in factories with counterfeit documents. These documents are available within artillery range of Homeland Security headquarters for about $150, and are readily available in all American cities. If the documents are ever questioned, the worker merely moves on to another state or factory. The worker regards the payroll taxes that they pay and never will collect on as a cost of doing business. SSAN regards this as a free infusion to the system. And the existing laws are not enforced.
We have few workers doing day laborer jobs here, except part-time and on weekends to make more money.
I think we need the following to control the situation:
1. A Fence to control the flow.
2. Counterfeit-proof documentation.
3. Enforcement and/or stiffening of employer sanctions.
4. I also think the law should be changed so that children born to illegals here do not automatically become US citizens.
5. A good streamlined guest worker program (not the Bush/Kennedy Bastardization Amnesty Scheme) for employers who suffer from genuine labor shortages as a result of the implementation of 1-4 above.
Of course work visas for âguest workersâ have existed for more than 20 years. You can check them out in the comment next below.
Good thread Pat. Now donât addle you liver(the worm in the bottom of the bottle is vicious for that).
VISAS, VISAS, EVERYWHERE
Eric
Got that many in the valley, eh?
I have been acquainted with “Le Cafard” for so long that the critter in the bottle looks like an old friend. pl
All:
The border between Mexico and US is not a geographically natural border that is delineated by physical barriers. When US took one-third of Mexican territory in the 19-th century it also took over a large number of Mexicans. Thus, there are ties of blood, language, and culture across the US-Mexico border that has to be accepted as facts-on-the-ground. This border cannot be secured with any reasonable expenditure; and then what for?
There is a giant sucking sound in US; the sound of jobs being created in US that most Americans are not willing to do but Mexican will. This demand is being met by Mexicans.
I do not see any reason for complaining.
I actually think that the Presidentâs immigration reform policy is good policy.
Firstly, from a practical point of view, there is snow ballâs chance in hell of sending 11 million people back to their countries of origin.
Secondly, under the reform proposals, the illegal immigrants will pay a fine.
Thirdly, they will become strong stakeholders in US since they will be given hope of becoming citizen after a long probation period.
Fourthly, from a humanitarian point of view, by forgiving them, US will be extending the protection of law to them. Currently, these illegal immigrants have no practical recourse to law if they are subject to criminal activities; they fear the legal structure of the United States. Thus, the criminal element in US can take advantage of them with impunity.
Fifthly, they are brought within the legal structure of US and thus could be taxed more efficiently.
Sixthly, forgiving them is an act of generosity of spirit of which the people and the government of US can be justly proud.
Seventhly, the introduction of the work visas for Mexicans will rationalize the flow of people across the US-Mexico border, it improves bilateral relation, reduce border patrol cost, and make possible the tracking and management of this work force.
Eighthly, in this manner, US President can actually have some ammunition to demand a broadly similar treatment for US citizen who wish to work or live in Mexico.
@Pat
Yes. We have our fair share. And a Mexican friend I have known for years thinks 35-40% are illegal.
Just curious. Did you go to Monterey for the Spanish or just pick it up?
I studied a lot of LA History in college, but am only moderately fluent in Spanglish.
Eric
I did Spanish at the east coast DLI in ’64 or so, then went to the 8th SF Group in LA for a couple of years before joining the gang in VN.
The 8th was the core of the LA Special Action Task Force. we were based in the Canal Zone and did traing all over LA. This was the period of the “allianza para al progresso” and the Cubans and we “danced” together all over Central and South America. pl
Immigration reform is an election year gimmick designed to divert attention away from the foreign and domestic policy failures of the current ruling party.
It is this year’s gay marriage, and it’s supposed to get “the base’ to the polls in November.
Good luck.
“Sounds like a Swift idea”
Swift only insofar as it’s politically impossible. Am I personally for such modesty? Si a los dos. Robb this morning: “This isn’t as crazy or satirical as it sounds. Economic portability and the ability to shop between political zones is the essence of the fully evolved market-state system.”
As for fences making for good neighbors: quick Californians! before relations with Oregonians sour! build it! make haste!
Col, I knew I could depend on you for some sanity…babak and lina also have some good points…will your readers who want to send these people back where they came from ever grasp what this would do to the US economy which now has only two job categories 10service and agriculture, 2) financial services. These illegals got here with imagination, willfulness and initiative…that’s how everyone got here who is worth their salt. The Jamestown settlement didn’t have to deal with INS did they? Let these people stay and thrive and give them a long tough route to citizenship. Throw the criminal aliens out and then try to protect the borders…but if you’ve been there and flown that border with DEA and US Customs as I have, you realize very quickly, this is fool’s errand. Do the best you can. Michael Singer
Eric
Well, my idea was better (I think) that Dr. Swift’s concept for dealing with the overpopulation of Ireland. pl
Ithink this is one of the best debates you have started here Col..
Interesting to see so many different opinions..
Mac..Good luck with the Bar Exam..
Canuck..interesting comments..
Eric..Good recommendations..
Comment…I agree with Pat..this is bigger than a Psy/Op Campaign for poor Migrant Workers having Rights and Permits..
BUSH seems to be constantly Capitualiting to the Demands of his good Friend Senior FOX..
The Fox in the HEN House..
I think Bush should be demanding every trade off that Pat mentions ABOVE..
Think what it would do to Improve the MEXICAN Economy..then lots of these Migrants could stay home because they would have Jobs..
YEP…Seal the Borders..
Use some of those Zillion Dollar Budgets to Document the workers here..State by State..
Employers required to report them..
ID them..Green Card THEM..
NO Citizenship for KIDS..
They are here ILLEGALLY..
Send the Gangs..and Trouble Makers Back to Mexico..AFTER they are Finger Printed and ID’d..
Sucking up to ONE WORLDERS makes me sick..But the Media does thier PSY/OPS for them..
Yep..Trot out the Kids..the poor Migrants..
Like Tijuana Beggers..
What about the Organized Crime element and the Real POLITICS behind this whole event..??
This is a Political Revolution People..
A lot of Mexicans are Laughing about this..
Just Reclaiming what they believe is Really thiers in the First Place..
“Viva La Revolution”..amigos..
Thats what you Will hear in L.A..”LOS~ AMIGOS”
Now I think the white man is beginning to Understand how the Native American indians Felt..
Gonna take some pretty Smart People to solve this Problem..
Smarter than George Custer..
And more Diplomatic..
“There is a giant sucking sound in US; the sound of jobs being created in US that most Americans are not willing to do but Mexican will.”
Unfortunately these are the only jobs this economy creates anymore. We were once a nation of computer programmers and engineers, now we’re a country of waiters and cashiers. If our congressmen and women were serious about the current immigration situation in regard to its effect on the working class, why did they bury in the immigration bill a provision to increase H1B visas by 20% every year? I posted earlier to draw a comparison to our immigration problem to the ancient romans immigration problems, not as a call to arms but rather to illustrate that what we are facing is a historical inevitability. History is the story of the great migration of peoples and there is nothing we can do to stop it.
The scale of illegal immigration makes deportation a near impossibility. This article attempts to tackle the problem in ways that gradually decrease the volume of illegal aliens.
The Real ID Act may be a step in the right direction?
Building physical fences is ludicrous. Laws and the enforcement of them are the types of deterrents that are effective. The laws and legislation that is enacted must be reasonable and accepted by the majority of the public or they are useless exercises within democratic nations. Draconian legislation such as HR4437 will meet with substantial resistance as is presently occurring in American cities.
It is very important that the new ReaLID Act doesnât repeat what has happened at the IRS and the issuance of Taxpayer Identification Numbers
According to this data 28% were illegal aliens in 2005
Mexico is the primary source country of both legal and illegal immigrants. Mexico accounted for about 30 percent of the foreign-born in 2000, and more than half of Mexicans residing in the United States in 2000 were illegal aliens.
And see these these immigration statistics which points out that amnesty does not reduce the number of illegal aliens from Mexico. By 2005, some 9.6 million to 9.8 million illegal aliens lived in the United States. Thatâs 2.2 million less Mexicans than the 12 million I have seen that is frequently referred to as the number of illegals that presently live in the United States.
The article points out that in â1986 mass amnesty exacerbated the Mexican illegal immigration problem.â
I writer of this article, does appear to reach some unusual conclusions at the end of his article, He has difficulty with the concepts of âdual nationalityâ, âsexualityâ and âbirthright citizenshipâ Birthright citizenship is an accepted standard in the world. Also there is widespread acceptance of citizenships of children born on ships. Whether he twisted the data to support his conclusions, I donât know. Iâm not a statistician, I was just looking for figures that were reasonably accurate about legal and illegal immigration.
The thing is what the colonel suggests (seemingly not too seriously) is more or less the direction the world is headed, or at least the world of the elites in most countries. People aren’t just demanding free movement of labor across borders (so to speak–which is what immigrant rights claim is based on), but also of goods and capital: removal of capital controls has been one of the key aims of global trading types for practically every country, and yes, that includes the ability to repatriate every cent of the profit back to your home base.
Well, economically speaking, this isn’t actually such a bad idea–provided that politics and society and people don’t get in the way. But the world doesn’t operate merely for the sake of economic efficiency…
@cannuck:
My anecdotal experience in the last three years, verified by the government, is 30%; admittedly a micro view. Just reporting what my indigenous sources on the ground surmise, when presenting the somewhat larger percentage.
@Duck;
Love the handle. Do you dress in black, like Daffy or the equally daffy Charles the Rash, late Duke of Burgundy? Just curious.
Frankly, the one question I want politicians and people who support amnesty etc for illegal aliens to answer is: Why should this law (set of laws) not be enforced but others that some substantial portion of our population disagree with should? For instance, drug laws, where one can argue the harm is mostly to the user since legalization would remove the need for most of the related violence. Anyway, we claim the US is a nation of laws and like any other law, obey it or try and change it but violators should be held up to the same risk of arrest across the board.
Right On Bill..
Key word is ILLEGAL..and Bush Wants to tolerate it
so His Friends on Both sides of the Border will be HAPPY..
Immediately took us to WAR..Half the world away..
Using National Security Hysteria..and Psy/Ops..
But won’t GUARD Our Borders..
HYPOCRITE ..
Psy/Ops.Playing Games with the American People….Political Manipulation at its WORST..Everyone Knows it..
Double Speak..Double Standards..UGLY POLITICS..
Besides..this is bigger than finding Apple Pickers..
Like Pat..I like the same things Mexican too..the Food..The music..the Hard Working Honest people..
NOT Gangsters..Drug Dealers..Drug Cartels..Corruption..or a Kick Back Crime Cartel that deals in Human Flesh ..Slave Traders..In Cheap Labor and SMUGGLES them..Drugs and Terrorists into OUR Country ILLEGALLY..
Thats the side of this Story we DON”T hear..
SMUGGLE..ILLEGALS..CONTRABAND..HUMANS OR DRUGS OR EXPLOSIVES..
ITS~ALL SMUGGELING..ALSO ILLEGAL..
We have a Legitament NATIONAL SECURITY Problem Folks..Reason enough to Close and Guard the BORDERS..NOW..
Slam them SHUT..Tight..if it takes the National Guard and Citizen Watch Groups to HELP Out..
We have Legitimate Regulated Border Crossings..Anyone wanting to enter the United States should Use them ..
Like LAW~ABIDING `PEOPLE..
Let the One Worlders..take thier Psy/Ops Media Manipulators..Politicians..and Ten Million ILLEGALS..and go to Mexico City and PROTEST..and Demand JOBS and Complain about POLICY..and Expose the Corruption Down THERE..
NOT on the Streets of the United States…
WRONG place to Protest..
BUSH..Homeland Security Begans at Home..Not half a World Away..What a Waste of Money..Lifes and Resources…
Everyone knows what you Have Done
God..What a Hypocrite..
What the Heck ever Happened to Good Sense and Honesty and Straight Talk..?????
Thanks Col. Lang..for Leading the Way..
You are FIVE STARS..
in My Eyes…
Eric,
Daffy Duck is naked dude, he doesn’t dress in any color.
Pat,
A recent Zakaria column in the WP discussing immigration made a good point. The EU has a huge problem with disaffected immigrants that are a true underclass. This is what has caused much of the rioting we see on TV, and has lead to “resident” terrorists in much of the EU. Giving all immigrants to the US a chance to become citizens must not be stopped. I am not in favor of making this easy or granting amnesty, but making a large segment of the US population nothing but peons is not a good long term strategy for preventing terrorism.
As far as building fences or walls to prevent illegal immigrants, that would be a futile as the war on drugs has turned out. In order to make our borders protect us from terrorists we have to find a means to reduce the flow of illegal immigrants. We need to attack the demand problem in the US first. Companies knowingly OR UNKNOWINGLY hiring illegally need to be slapped with realistic fines. Document forgers need to be stopped. Existing laws need to be enforced rather than ignored. This is where to start as I’m sure even more would be required to reduce the supply side of the equation.
The debate about building walls means that our “fight” against terrorism has gone WAY off track. We have stopped playing to our strengths and given in to what OBL wants us to do. Our country in the 90’s scared the shit out of folks like OBL. Things like economic success, freedom, and a country that stood for equal rights for all was going to steam roll the backwards ME in the long run. We are a country that wins when we’re over there selling cheesburgers and loses when we have to attack. That’s not to say attacking is not necessary – Afghanistan was required.
Glen
The Canadian federal government recently announced that they would not grant amnesty to those illegal immigrants who are undocumented workers in Canada. Canadian immigration policies are attempting to make it easier for foreign workers to legally immigrate to Canada to solve the country’s labour shortage problems.
Why not draft illegal immigrants into the Army and send them to Iraq to fight? If they are killed, make them US citizens and pay benefits to their loved ones.
Wouldn’t this solve several problems all at once?
The immigration debate is interesting because it still is a debate—without entrenched partisan positions. Yet. However, the “haves” (as in monied-connected classes) are losing no time in staking out the territory that really matters, i.e. the bottom line:
GOVT CONTRACT awarded! To accommodate the detention of tens of thousands of people, Homeland Security, in 2005, awarded Halliburton’s subsidiary KBR a $385 million contingency contract to build detention camps in the United States. According to the Halliburton web site, “The contract provides for establishing temporary detention and processing capabilities to augment existing Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) Detention and Removal Operations (DRO) Program facilities in the event of an emergency influx of immigrants into the US, or to support the rapid development of new programs”.
Thus, we will round up undocumented, put them in camps, send them back to country of origin, then do it all over again. A perpetual motion cash machine with a subsidiary of Halliburton overseeing the flow.
You couldn’t make up this stuff!
Col Lang,
If you don’t mind having a Mexican real estate trust as a partner, you can have your dream hacienda on the beach in Mexico anytime you like. That’s the only flaw I see in your otherwise brilliant proposal.
And I certainly agree with you that we should not cut the Canadians in on this deal. In fact, we should tighten our immigration requirements and require them to fill out a pointless, five-page document with confusing instructions every time they try to enter our country. That way we can ensure that that most essential of Canadian traits, i.e. irritation with incomprehensible American policy, will endure indefinitely.
I don’t know, Colonel, about your plan, but let me think on it. My guess is that a significant part of the Mexican economy is already owned by or related to US companies/interests–but I don’t have time yet to verify that.
As far as going to Mexico and staying for large amounts of time, from what I understand, many snow birds–ie, US senior citizens who find it difficult to make it on SS benefits–winter south of the border.
Have you visited your local Maqilladora yet? Perhaps you could stop in and see how they’re doing.
Anyway, before sarcasm gets the better part of valor here, I wonder whether you’ve seen the resolution by a Utah Republican operative that states “officially” that Satan is using illegal immigrants to undermine and ultimately destroy the US.
According to this man (as reported by the Salt Lake Tribune):
As I ask at my blog, how far up the pecking order of the Rep. party do ideas like this guy’s get before they become “stealthy” and encoded?
Mexico sends its children to the US.
The US sends its children to Iraq.
Iraq sends its children to Syria.
WHO NEEDS VISAS?
Of the three, the Mexicans are by far the happiest. Happiness counts for something.
Follow the H-1B Visa debate. The US has to offer Visas to foriegners because no Americans are able to fill the job openings.
BS-they are there, but they won’t work at salaries that are far below what it takes to support their family here, so much for the American Dream. In addition, due to the restrictions of that Visa, those employees are almost indentured servants to the companies (read the restrictions).
The immigration problem is the level of pay that the employers in America, you noticed I did not say American companies, are willing to pay. To hire an American, perhaps the CEO would have to reduce his salary to only 200 times what the average person makes, or the PE ratio would be down 1/4%.
Sooner or later the average person will not be able to buy the “MADE IN AMERICA” product.
I’m wrong, with the trade deficit what it is, that time is here!
American corporations are doing very well because of globalization, but if you want to see how much American individuals have, just take away their credit cards and see how much disposable income they have.
Americans are poor without credit; that is a simple fact.
How the free trade zealots can make a case for the need for coolies is beyond me. At this point in my life, being familiar with how two government agencies I have dealt with (INS and FAA) have been intentionally under funded by the congresscritters to the point where they cannot accomplish their mandates, I suggest giving all the illegal workers legal status since no one seems interested in actually enforcing any laws. This would be the last thing their employers want, as it gives the workers all sorts of legal protections and even allows them to, horror of horrors, unionize. And while weâre at it, let the new legal workers bring their families to the US so they donât have to send their money out of the country. It would be interesting to see how long it would take foreign governments to protest that idea.
While I am here, can anyone help me understand the resistance to having a national ID card? Iâve had to carry ID and a passport since a young age and never understood the privacy and freedom arguments against a national ID card. Privacy and freedom to do what? As for card forgeries, since current âgreen cardsâ and passports are connected now to computer files, it is more difficult without a government workerâs aid to make a fake card, since someone has to input the computer file to make the IDâs work.
I hope there is a special place in hell for hypocrites.
Who says we don’t already own quite a lot south of the border, and that you cannot retire there, live like a king, and enjoy “la cultura?”
I lived and worked in Central America for over a year. A gringo wallet full of greenbacks is the only law down there. With enough money you can do whatever you want, and “enough” isn’t that much. All sorts of gringos were coming out of the woodwork in Honduras, and I definitely didn’t want to know what most of them were up to. One owned a bar/brothel that was more brothel than bar. Many others were just as dubious. I doubt it’s very different in Mexico.
Sometimes we forget that there is the spirit of the law, not just the letter. The letter of our immigration law has become obsolete. Increase our quotas and bring these hard-working, family focused folks into the system. Leave our Constitution alone – we don’t need to change its definition of a citizen.
If you live in any area with a large latin american immigrant population, talk to the small business owners in the services and building trades. They’ll tell you how valuable these folks are. They are the new “true Americans” – they come here to chase the American dream and work hard to achieve it.
There is no way to have a reasonable conversation about this issue in this format. It involves nearly every facet of each issue of political systems, economics, the environment, the rule of law, social justice, race (the main factor in my opinion) and education.
But the main issues are race and class, and especially race, and the only evidence you need for that is imagining this scenario instead: we are being “invaded” by hordes of incredibly hard-working white people who’s only crime is that they come from rural poverty and so they work from before dawn until after dusk without complaint. White people who are as a rule quiet, respectful, religious, family-oriented people. White people who are motivated with an incredible work ethic. White people who are entrepenurial and start small businesses offering cuisine, imports, services and artisan products which are not native to this country and which we wouldn’t have access to otherwise. White people who wash your dishes, clean the guts out of your chicken, clean the asbestos out of your buildings and wipe your kid’s ass. All of that at prices that allow you to maintain the standard of living you have become accustomed to. White people who keep to themselves but generally don’t cause trouble because they know that if they do they will be thrown back into poverty and unable to feed their families.
I’m sure that in this “enlightened America” the conversation would be exactly the same. Please.
Borders are not the issue. Of course we need borders which are secure. The issue is legalizing immigration to more closely meet our demand for these people. Rather than artificially creating an illegal brown under-class that we can both exploit and at the same time blame for being there to exploit.