The latest news about the FBI–e.g., they apparently lost 5 months of text messages between star FBI au lovers, Strzok-Page texts, perhaps 50,000–points to incompetence or malfeasance and coverup. I go with the latter.
The dates of the missing texts are the key tell–14 December 2016 thru 17 May 2017. Pay particular attention to the 14 December date in light of what we now know about the Dossier prepared/written by British spy Christopher Steele. Please reference my previous piece on the Dossier timeline:
18. 13 December 2016, Christopher Steele prepares, on his own, the 17th report in the dossier and sends it to Senator McCain via David Kramer.
Here are the key highlights of that report:
2016/166–13 December 2016— US/RUSSIA: FURTHER DETAILS OF SECRET DIALOGUE BETWEEN TRUMP CAMPAIGN TEAM, KREMLIN AND ASSOCIATED HACKERS IN PRAGUE
SOURCES: Blacked out/Not Identified
TRUMP's representative COHEN accompanied to Prague in August/September 2016 by 3 colleagues for secret discussions with Kremlin representat ives and associated operators/hackers
Agenda included how to process deniable cash payments to operatives; contingency plans for covering up operations; and action in event of a CLINTON election victory
Some further details of Russian representatives/ operatives involved; Romanian hackers employed; and use of Bulgaria as bolt hole to "lie low»
Anti-CLINTON hackers and other operatives paid by both TRUMP team and Kremlin, but with ultimate loyalty to Head of PA, IVANOV and his successor/s
This information subsequently was used by FBI Director Comey, with the full knowledge of Strzok and Page, to obtain permission from a FISA court to "eavesdrop"/wiretap Donald Trump. The missing texts are likely to tell a story of FBI corruption and meddling that, if made public, will end the careers of several FBI agents and DOJ personnel. Stay tuned.
PT
These text messages are also critical evidence around the appointment of Mueller as special counsel which happened in May 2017. There is a back story there that these “missing” text messages would shed light on. Note that both Peter Strzok and Lisa Page were senior members of Mueller’s staff until some of their text messages were released by DOJ IG Horowitz. Strzok was the person that interviewed Flynn in the White House and set him up for the perjury charge.
The current batch of released text messages show that Bill Priestap, head of CI at the FBI removed the reference that Hillary emailed Obama from her unsecure server. Obama had previously denied that.
There is much more evidence piling up as the Congressional committees continue their investigation. Nunes already knows a lot and his summary memo will likely be released soon to the public. Additionally, many of these people at the FBI & DOJ including Strzok, Page, Priestap, Baker, etc will be testifying under oath to Congress soon as Rosenstein has already agreed to that. Admiral Rogers will also likely provide testimony after he retires from the NSA in couple months.
IMO, the critical piece of evidence is the now declassified FISC ruling. Nunes has seen the unredacted version.
The problem is that russiagate is an article of faith for its adherents.
This can be seen by the frequency with which the argument from ignorance is invoked: “Mueller hasn’t found anything but that just means he needs more time! In the meantime, we will assume that the most lurid allegations are true!”
This also can be seen by the amount of fake news published over russiagate. If the “evidence” were so “overwhelming”, why has the MSM walked back so many “bombshell revelations”? Why use lies if the truth is sufficient?
But the real point is that when people are confronted with incontrovertible proof that their core beliefs, the beliefs that make up their self-image and tribal membership are wrong, rather than change beliefs or change tribes to fit the facts, most people, most of the time, will deny the facts in order to avoid changing. Rather than express gratefulness for bringing the truth to light, people will attack the messenger, using words like “heretic”, “blasphemer” or even “Putin puppet”.
This phenomenon is called “cognitive dissonance”, and it is most sharply seen in cult members. However, there are entire religions and political movements based on this principle.
For its partisans, russiagate and other conspiracy theories provide a prime example of cognitive dissonance. Except that this is as a conspiracy theory for establishment types. MSM birthergate.
seeing how IG Horowitz had them in his possession August 2017, it beggars belief! https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-01-22/whos-lying-fbi-says-5-months-texts-lost-yet-ig-horowitz-says-his-office-received
I guess I always expect there to be Machiavellian palace intrigues and plots. So that doesn’t surprise me. It’s bad, very bad, but not surprising to this cynical mind.
What really strikes me is the sheer sophomoric idiocy of these people all the way up and down the chain. First, you have the democrats and the McCain cucks trying to undo the democratic process and, basically, arranging a circular firing squad to do it. Could they not imagine that the stupid collusion investigation might ultimately reveal their own unsavory machinations and bring about their own demise?
Then you have these oh so respectable FBI/DOJ types – some of whom deal in counter intelligence – cheating on their spouses and sending emails back and forth like hormone addled teenagers. Moreover, their emails contain incriminating language re; the palace coup. Haven’t these intel “experts” ever heard of opsec?
What a shabby bunch of “experts” and “professionals” we have in DC. Very disconcerting.
PT
Interesting!
Even Peter Strzok didn’t believe there was any collusion between Trump and Russia, after all he and others in the “secret society” at the FBI, DOJ and the IC did to build the narrative of collusion.
https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-01-23/jaw-dropping-text-message-fbi-agent-suggests-no-trump-collusion-russia
So the FBI had mis-configuration issues with their smart phones – must be the Russians \s. Would another three letter agency not be able to provide a copy of the texts from their records?
In my opinion, we are in a very dangerous space here. I would put Strozk and Page in protective custody right now. To me, the lovers texts indicate that the Intelligence community succumbed to “Trump derangement phenomenon” like most of the Liberal population and the mainstream media. They did not see a Trump win coming and were caught flat footed.
Lets be clear, what started as a “light hearted” bit of electoral character assassination – the russian collusion meme, golden showers and all, took on a life of its own after Trump won. Hilary Clinton grabbed it like a life preserver as an excuse for her electoral failure. The FBI and their DOJ colleagues suddenly found that their lighthearted jape was being investigated and that Trump and the saner members of Congress were not amused and now it appears to me that wholesale restructure of DOJ, the FBI and goodness knows what else is likely. To put that another way, if Trump had lost the election, would the Russian dossier etc. still be an issue? No.
My guess is that the IC wishes it had never seen that dossier, let alone awarded it a shred of credibility, let alone used it as a pretext for FISA based action. Trump is now going to after the IC community that did this and very probably going to start a restrucutre as a result. The FBI/DOJ “secret society” is at best petrified that they have been found out and will lose their careers. At worst the IC may believe its existence in its current form is threatened and is taking action to protect its power.
The alleged “loss” of five months of texts is to convenient to me to be explained by mere incompetence. My sense is that IC interests are now galvanised in a rear guard action to protect their power and that is why Strozk and Page need to be in custody, and on suicide watch, under the protection of Congress, assuming trusted law enforcement or military forces can be found.
Yup. I still have days where it is hard to get my head around the fact that I live on a planet where the majority are either mentally dysfunctional or mentally ill. Logic and Reason tempered by compassion is rare. There must be a few fine people holding things together out there. Kudos to them.
“Even after the evidence “for their beliefs has been totally refuted, people fail to make appropriate revisions in those beliefs,” the researchers noted. In this case, the failure was “particularly impressive,” since two data points would never have been enough information to generalize from.”
This article is a good writeup on the science but What is sad and humerous in this article is the last paragraph blaming Kellyanne Conway and Steve Bannon. The author is clueless to her own participation in cognitive bias.
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/02/27/why-facts-dont-change-our-minds
When you are part of the establishment, you don’t necessarily have to be very good. Mistakes are overlooked, errors in judgment forgiven.
n.b. HRC and her email fiasco. If she were a normie, she’d be in a SuperMax.
The picture says it better than the long explanation.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DUPK2BPU8AANkCW.jpg
That alleged secret society may extend to the State Department. During Comey’s investigation into Hillary’s private email server use, there were officials at the State Department who allegedly tried in vain to release Hillary’s emails all at once so that they could better coordinate among themselves (i.e., get their stories straight). And the deputy secretary, Patrick Kennedy, allegedly offered the investigating agents a quid pro quo bribe.
https://www.cnbc.com/2016/10/17/fbi-releases-100-new-pages-on-clinton-email-probe.html
Eric Newhill @ #5,
To paraphrase the “Queen of Mean”, Leona Helmsley, opsec is for the little people.
But hey, thank God that these inexpert and non-professional types were so incompetent in their practice (or even understanding of) opsec;
18 U.S. Code § 2384 – Seditious conspiracy
Publius,
50,000 texts in 151 days? That’s more than 300 a day. When the hell was the Chief of the Counterespionage Section of the FBI doing his actual job rather than acting like a teenager overwhelmed by hormones? Why the hell is he now in “human resources” when it quite apparent that his professional judgement is compromised?
Alt-right activist Jack Posobiec claims that all FBI Galaxy S5 smart phones come preloaded with the Samsung Knox Security Suite which automatically archives text messages, and that this can’t be disabled without FBI IT admin express action.
According to experts, FBI “lost” text messages proving ‘Obama-Hillary collusion’ can be found (Video)
http://theduran.com/according-to-experts-fbi-lost-text-messages-proving-obama-hillary-collusion-can-be-found-video/
It’s also suggested that if any of these people used syncing to their PCs or home PCs that the messages could be found, as well anyone who synced with iMessage, an Apple platform.
The Strzok email explicitly claiming there is no “there there” on Trump collusion is itself a real find. If one of the main architects of Russiagate doesn’t think they can prove it, then Mueller doesn’t have much hope of doing so.
Walrus,
Trump and his family are the ones who need additional protection from an assasination attempt. Is Air Force maintenance any better than the US Navy’s? You might have read of a few of their snafus. Maybe Melania staying home while the President goes to Davos is about something other than disaffection with her husband from yet another recycled allegation of an extramarital sexual tryst.
Thank you Publius Tacitus and blue peacock for keeping us abreast on this momentous conspiracy at the highest levels of our government. It is clear that we don’t have a republic anymore. The question is how much sunshine will we get and if anyone is held to account and most importantly will there be a top to bottom clean-up.
Incompetent plotting.
These self-important dolts have seen too many movies.
If Strzok is a “star” at the FBI, no wonder it took them and the CIA (another collection of “rocket surgeons”) 10 years to uncover that Chinese spy.
These people – through sheer ineptitude – are more dangerous to themselves than anyone else.
You know how these “Inspector Clouseau’s” will finally defeat the Chinese and Russian spy services?
The Russians and Chinese will die laughing.
JJ,
I agree with the “no quarter” suggestion. These people are traitors, as you basically say, to the Constitution they swore to uphold. The time is now to make examples of such people. The public needs to understand that something very wrong did happen and they will understand that if the punishment meets the crime. Otherwise, it’s just more partisan political mudslinging to their minds.
I think that sever punishment is what will happen. Jeff Sessions (and Trump) is now approaching the point where he is unbound from the chains of potential – and likely – allegations of obstruction of justice. He can now deal with Mueller and the rest of them. The swamp will experience a major draining of unprecedented proportions. Some will be jailed. Some will leave office for “personal reasons/more time with family/pursue other opportunities”. I can foresee Clinton being brought up on charges stemming from the server/classified emails and god knows what else. Lynch will get wrapped up. Obama himself is probably facing some risk here. McCain will use his brain cancer as an out, but he should go down too. I think they will protect him somewhat though because of his war hero status and because he’s on the way out anyhow.
Trump now looks pretty smart and correct for canning Comey (who is facing a world of hurt for lying to Congress and conspiracy in fixing the Clinton email investigation). The entire democrat/leftist meme set is falling apart in a very ugly way across the entire spectrum; from this un-democratic plot to preferring illegal aliens over actual citizens. I predict the left will merely double down on stupid insanity. Nov 2018 is the Republicans’ to lose.
It isn’t just that people underestimate Trump. It’s that those who oppose him are proving to be utterly feeble minded, undisciplined fools. And they’re in the wrong. A very bad combination when people like Trey Gowdy are gunning for you.
Oh, very well…
https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-01-21/15-year-old-hacker-impersonated-cia-director-and-other-high-ranking-officials
Our Best and Brightest, indeed.
In my feline experience, cognitive dissonance is as much a problem of the intelligent and well educated as it is of the doltish and poorly educated.
Keep in mind that much of “knowledge work” these days consists not at getting at the truth, but of using facts and inferences to support whatever it is that you or the person who is paying you wants them to support.
A particularly egregious example is how the Tobacco Institute for decades engaged highly credentialed scientists, specialists in their respective fields, to argue that first, that there was no link between smoking and cancer, and then, to argue that such a link couldn’t be proven, and finally, in the face of overwhelming evidence, that such link was weaker than the evidence made it seem.
All
IMO Trey Gowdy R-SC should be named Special Counsel for investigation of this massive conspiracy involving DoJ,FBI,The Clinton Campaign/CIA, etc. He has been a state prosecutor and a federal prosecutor. His district in upland South Carolina is so red that he would certainly be replaced by another conservative Republican. I urge you all to press for his appointment. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trey_Gowdy pl
NOT an Onion article… LOL…
Comey to teach course on ethical leadership for College of William & Mary https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/comey-to-teach-course-on-ethical-leadership-for-college-of-william-and-mary/2018/01/18/4ea7b2ca-fc8d-11e7-8f66-2df0b94bb98a_story.html
“I am thrilled to have the chance to engage with William & Mary students about a vital topic — ethical leadership,” Comey said in a statement. “Ethical leaders lead by seeing above the short term, above the urgent or the partisan, and with a higher loyalty to lasting values, most importantly the truth. Building and maintaining that kind of leadership, in both the private sector and government, is the challenge of our time. There is no better place to teach and learn about it than the W&M Washington Program.”
—————
Words fail me…
Eric,
From what I have read, it seems it is Nunes’ doggedness that has uncovered the evidence that we see now. His summary memo will be released soon despite the Democrats opposition. That and the testimony of the key conspirators and the IG report as well as the obstruction by the FBI & DOJ will increase the calls for a special counsel.
Let’s see how all this plays out in the next few months. Trump is going to come out of this much stronger as many voters see how he was screwed over by the Obama administration.
Sir,
I have read that many on the right are not too keen on Gowdy due to his failure to get to the bottom of what happened in Benghazi.
jack
What is it that you think happened at Benghazi? What I see is an Obama Administration failure to harden US facilities at Benghazi followed up by an Obama Administration denial of their failure. Far too many people seek perfection of outcome in an imperfect world. pl
PT,
The dog ate my homework much? There’re no missing text messages. The NSA has a copy of everything that crosses the towers and servers of U.S. telecommunications companies.
The Trump team can retrieve the text messages between the FBI love birds either via appointing a special counsel or administrative subpoenas.
Exactly. It’s certainly ironic that Strzok, a lead FBI investigator of Hillary’s stupid use of official email over a private server, would continue to send stupid personal texts over an official line, having learned nothing. Although Hillary’s problem was arguably worse for endangering national security.
Is he so cheap that he couldn’t afford to use a personal phone to text his mistress (to say nothing of stupid)? All of the cheating dogs I know use more than one phone for such purposes.
I expect the FBI will be able to easily recover the text messages, NSA won’t be necessary. From what we’ve seen so far, imo, all it will amount to are more strangled cries of lawyers in love.
However, for anyone who’s already tooth-deep in believing the conspiracy narrative against Trump, this is read meat. Big in the news cycle, on the same day we hear that Mueller is inviting Trump for a little chat. The FBI’s bureaucrats don’t seem too smart but the Republican congress is playing this thing pretty well. It’s a good song, play it on repeat.
agree yes
+ an over exuberant USA ambassador who thought his personal charisma was a defense against armed attack
+ a secret CIA operation nearby that was gathering Kadafi arms for shipment to overthrow Syrian government
outthere
Yes. pl
DC
“Mueller is inviting Trump for a little chat.” Trump has had and still has the legal and constitutional power to remove Sessions, Rosenstein, Comey, Flynn, Mueller, the present FBI chief, Strzok, etc. In the case of the civil servants he might have to put them, each and every one, in an empty room with a desk and a telephone but he could get rid of all of them. Obstruction of justice as a charge in some forum? The lawyers will tell you that such a charge can only be proven if intent to obstruct in the context of his legal power can by proven to exist. How do you think that would be established? Do you think that he has written something that would establish it? Do you think that one of his associates, Flynn maybe, would rat him out on this? Or do you think that Mueller will trick or provoke him into incriminating himself? Collusion with Russia? Really? are your friends still pushing that? pl
DC,
Even worse in funny kinda way…
…Sometimes I think that Page is a source of leaks, texts, etc.; perhaps cooperating with the Rs.
Maybe Strzok promised her he’d leave his wife for her or get her a promotion, something like that, but then didn’t deliver. Hell hath no fury….
…and If you’re the cheatin kind, you’re the cheatin kind.
DC
More – Maybe Mueller can accuse Trump of being an undetected sex criminal? Perhaps a failure to register under FARA (if the statute hasn’t run), How about a money launderer? Adulterer with some whore? What? pl
I dunno, honestly, how they intend to prove it. So far, they’ve got some stuff that we know about and don’t know about, and I don’t want to pretend I know the truth. I think prudence requires that I don’t judge Trump as innocent before there’s enough substance — not simply innuendo or implication — for me to believe he’s not guilty. This is rather important crucible we’re in right now; hot heads and trigger fingers are not what what we should be promoting.
Sundance has two interesting posts on how the Russiagate “co-conspirators” are handling these weekly revelations on the Obama administration conspiracy.
One is about the WaPo, writing a story based on “information from a senior official”. You know one of those, wherein allegedly McCabe was asked by Trump in the White House if he voted for him. This same McCabe, Comey’s deputy, whose wife received a slug of cash from Terry McAuliffe, Clinton consigliere. McCabe is the guy in whose office the FBI lovers who couldn’t text each other enough, discussed the “insurance policy”. McCabe is being allowed to hang on at the FBI on the taxpayer dime until March so that he can collect his pension.
https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2018/01/23/deep-state-via-washington-post-fights-back-and-defends-andrew-andy-mccabe/
This story got me thinking what will the WaPo, NY Times, CNN, NBC, and the rest of the corporate media, who have invested so much selling the Russiagate narrative do, when it gets blown out of the water with the unraveling of the conspiracy at the highest levels of the Obama administration? What are they gonna do to keep their NeverTrumper vendetta going? They lost big time the first round, when despite their massive efforts, Trump won the election. Then they doubled down with Russiagate, which could actually strengthen Trump not weaken him when the truth comes out as is happening right now.
The next one is about the Democrat leadership. This one is actually hilarious. Dianne Feinstein and Adam Schiff, the ranking members on the Senate & House Intelligence committees, writing Jack Dorsey & Mark Zuckerberg to investigate the Russian collusion in the trending of #ReleaseTheMemo.
https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2018/01/23/adam-schiff-and-dianne-feinstein-demand-twitter-investigate-releasethememo/
Fred, you feel it’s still possible?
Even if I let him work 7 days a week, and 10 hours it feels beyond the power of hormones, I included Dec 14 & May 17 which makes 155 days:
50,000 : 155 = 322.58064…: 10 = 32.2580
Alternatively I assume he does work neither on Saturday, Sunday or on Holidays. Then we get 107 days. We still let him work 10 hours:
50,000 : 467.2897 : 10 = 46,72
In the first scenario he has at least 2 second to mail or respond 30 times per hour.
doubtful.
You seem as naively credulous as that dumb Maddow woman.
Jack,
All the credit goes to Publius Tacitus! He spurred my interest on this story.
As I reviewed the writings of others who were following the story closely and developed the time line for my benefit, it became evident to me that the declassified FISC ruling is a crucial piece of evidence. This is the first document in the public domain that shows that there were systematic violations of FISA 702 in the period leading up to March 2016. A FISA 702 violation can only happen if there were no national security requirements to the queries. This FISC ruling would not have happened if Admiral Rogers didn’t first order a compliance review and then go to FISC to report these violations.
Nunes and the other Gangof8 have read the unredacted FISC ruling, which means they know who ran the queries and which subcontractors were provided unauthorized access to the data so obtained. They also now have read the FISA application that was granted in October 2016 and know what part the Steele dossier played in that application. Nunes has also read the PDBs leading up to the election, and as he has stated publicly there was no Russia related information but there was information from the incidental collection on American citizens.
Nunes and Congressional investigators I believe have a pretty good understanding of the conspiracy and who the key players were. They are in the process of collecting additional evidence and putting the puzzle together, while at the same time preparing what they have uncovered in a form that does not compromise “sources & methods” for release to the public. The first step in this will be the declassification and release of the summary memo prepared by Nunes.
The Democrat strategy it seems is fourfold. a)Claim that the Congressional investigation and release of information to the public undermines Mueller. b) Compromises national security c) Is partisan and does not reflect the reality of the underlying evidence d) Keep focusing on Russians behind every corner.
Jack, you noted in the earlier thread about evidence flow. That is an important observation. The evidence flow right now is clearly on the side of proving the conspiracy. Russiagate proponents better start gaining some serious evidence flow soon, or they will be swept by the avalanche of evidence around the conspiracy, that is going to be coming out over the next few months.
Sid Finster
“When Prophecy Fails: A Social and Psychological Study of a Modern Group That Predicted the Destruction of the World is a classic work of social psychology by [Festinger, Riecken, and Schachter] which studied a small UFO [cult] in Chicago … and its coping mechanisms after the [destruction of the world] did not occur. Festinger’s theory of cognitive dissonance can account for the psychological consequences of disconfirmed expectations. One of the first published cases of dissonance was reported in this book.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/When_Prophecy_Fails
The most interesting part of the book (to me) is that the more evidence mounts that their cult is built on a lie – the more the adherents come to believe in it!
DC
What a fine American you are! You don’t believe that Trump is innocent unless it is proven to you? No presumption of innocence for you! Oh no! What’s the matter? Would your limousine liberal friends in Old Town scorn you if you were not “on board?” Your objection to the behavior of these scoundrels in the Deep State is that they are inept and their pretentious little plot is coming apart. pl
LewisE
Whom are you addressing? pl
PT
Please keep us up to date.
Apparently, the doggy dossier was used to obtain a FISA warrant to bug the President-Elect and Peter Strzok purposefully setup a FBI perjury trap to remove the President’s National Security Advisor. If this is documented, it is proof that there is an ongoing intelligence community/media counter coup against Donald Trump. This can’t be hidden. There can only be one response; restoration of the rule of law and jail time for high-level criminals. If not, the Constitution is dead. The problem is that Trump Derangement Syndrome blinds believers. They can’t see that the coup attempt is one of the knives stabbed in the back of democracy.
Sid – Indeed we can “cognitive dissonance” in many fields Russiagate, so called “Russian Threat” to Western Democracy’s, with Brexit (on both sides of the argument) and of course Syria.
Yes, LE, some times my mind blocks more other times less. Can you help me out or initiate me? Tell me how and were the number surfaced for instance? Or otherwise assist one of the feeble minded in the SST community?
Another offer:
Ok, they were lovers and the mail went backward and forward potentially 24 hours a day for 155 days, as first calculation above including Saturday, Sunday and Holidays. We give both equal chances as sender and recipient and both have 24 hours a day to do the job:
50.000 : 155 = 322.58064 : 2 = 161,29
Both the gallant and the lady still have to send each other 161 mails every single day. Well yes, spread over 24 hours it’s strictly only 6-7 mails per hour. It’s getting better.
DC, that’s the wrong way round:
that I don’t judge Trump as innocent before there’s enough substance
It is innocent until proven guilty.
Christ Almighty! Should have known. Odd we have the same number again: 50,000. Now that’s an effective message.
Donald “The Genius”, PR man:
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/956012274942128128
I believe is was Adam Schiff who said the memo should not be released publicly as, “the American people just wouldn’t understand it”. I guess he’s just a lot smarter than most of us, ha ha ha.
I will humbly suggest that it is possible for two truths in this case to co-exist: (1) the deep state was so concerned about trump that it conspired to violate due process; and (2) there actually was, and is, cause for concern.
DC
What was and is the cause for concern? A lack of good taste? He likes fast food? pl
LeaNder,
I’m sure your cognitive abilites are not impacted by the disruption of reading, considering and responding to this volume of text messages. “I assume he does work neither on Saturday, Sunday or on Holidays.” What’s the working schedule for intellegence professionals hostile to the USA? Do they only work 9-5 or do they have the French 36 hour work week with extended holidays?
Bottom line — is anybody going to jail? The FBI thinks they are above the law, at least that’s the way they behave, and have behaved in the past on far too many occasions. Will Sessions and Trump make the FBI crooks do a frog-march straight to lock-up?
This is just one more reason IMO why the FBI needs to be dismantled, as our nation doesn’t need a national ‘political’ policia.
If criminal investigations spanning state lines are required, then let there be departmental cooperation between the various state law enforcement agencies. State law enforcement working togeather accomplish more than most federal agencies sticking their fingers in the pie.
Let’s do away with the FBI, it serves no useful purpose.
Honorable Colonel, the cause(s) for concern is/are writ large in the media, for well over a year. Problem is, which media do you trust. The nation is as divided as I’ve ever seen it, concerning this question. I continue to believe that truth exists, and truth is not an existential question; but for many of our fellows this concern seems lost. With respect to what Mueller is doing, I imagine a short list of issues include money laundering, financial fraud, tax evasion, international and domestic deals with “the mob,” campaign finance violations, and of course “collusion” with a foreign power to undermine the election, and obstruction of justice vis a vis the Comey firing. It will be interesting to read “the facts” with respect to the criminal charges, if or when Mueller is able to put the relevant facts on the table.
DC: let’s say that were true. So is your position that due process is de facto optional, as as law enforcement itself decides that the matter is important?
More importantly, once you give the unelected and unaccountable (even Congress doesn’t know what their real budgets are) Deep State a veto over election results they don’t like, you are no longer living in a Republic, but in something else.
But why worry? Surely history shows that the Praetorian Guard ever always only acted selflessly and in the best and highest interests of Rome and its citizens, right?
Right?
https://nypost.com/2018/01/23/evidence-suggests-a-massive-scandal-is-brewing-at-the-fbi/
“…each day brings credible reports suggesting there is a massive scandal involving the top ranks of America’s premier law enforcement agency. The reports, which feature talk among agents of a “secret society” and suddenly missing text messages, point to the existence both of a cabal dedicated to defeating Donald Trump in 2016 and of a plan to let Hillary Clinton skate free in the classified email probe.
If either one is true — and I believe both probably are — it would mean FBI leaders betrayed the nation by abusing their powers in a bid to pick the president.
More support for this view involves the FBI’s use of the Russian dossier on Trump that was paid for by the Clinton campaign and the Democratic National Committee. It is almost certain that the FBI used the dossier to get FISA court warrants to spy on Trump associates, meaning it used the opposition research of the party in power to convince a court to let it spy on the candidate of the other party — likely without telling the court of the dossier’s political link.
Even worse, there is growing reason to believe someone in President Barack Obama’s administration turned over classified information about Trump to the Clinton campaign.”
Personally, I question the last paragraph. I suspect that it was either other members of Team R And/or the Clinton campaign that provided the dossier to the FBI.
IIRC, the Heaven’s Gate cult committed suicide, but only after the beaming up did not proceed as originally scheduled.
The Jim Jones mass suicide provides another instructive example.
Because the point of Benghazi appears to have been the CIA gathering arms to ship off to the Moderate Jihadi Headchopper Unicorn Army v.20 or somesuch, I don’t think Gowdy or other Congressional Republicans would be allowed to get to the bottom of things, even if they tries.
What will happen if Mueller finds that President Trump colluded with the Russians and/or obstructed justice, and the HPSCI finds the FBI, DOJ, etc. guilty of crimes?
This is fascinating.
You already know without evidence that the Page – Sztrok missing text messages are a nothingburger, just “lawyers in love” (yuck!) but you also know without evidence that Trump must be guilty.
This is like legal procedure as invented by the Queen of Hearts in Alice in Wonderland. Sentence, then verdict, then trial.
DC
” … money laundering, financial fraud, tax evasion, international and domestic deals with “the mob,” campaign finance violations, and of course “collusion” with a foreign power to undermine the election, and obstruction of justice vis a vis the Comey firing. It will be interesting to read “the facts” with respect to the criminal charges” How much of that menu of the MSM and Democratic party meme portfolio constitute “high crimes and misdemeanors” and/or could be used in an impeachment and trial? pl
Mark,
Are you being serious? There is no such CRIME as COLLUSION. What the hell does that even mean? Did Trump take money from the Russian Government to fund his campaign? NO. Did Trump seek out Russian input to his campaign? NO. The entire meme painting Trump as a stooge of Putin was nothing more than a sophisticated information operation that had the help of the FBI and the CIA in trying to smear Trump.
Indeed, Sir, “what could be used?” On this point, I suspect we’re going to have to read up on the “fruit of the poisonous tree” doctrine (assuming that Mueller is not removed, which would have its own problems):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fruit_of_the_poisonous_tree
Pay particular attention to “exception no. 2.” In order to prove that any evidence is “poison,” then somehow NSA methods may have to be disclosed. In private, hermetically sealed, court session? Can we expect the public to be comfortable with that? What a mess.
Thanks PT.
Mark produces a classic argument from ignorance, a favorite pastime of russiagate partisans.
“Just because no evidence has been found that Mark is in fact Mickey Mouse doesn’t mean that evidence won’t be someday found – in fact, this just means that we need to look harder! Until conclusive proof is found, we can safely assume that Mark has big round ears and a tail….”
Yes, Fred, “intelligence professionals hostile to the USA”. The Swamp. Got that. Completely non-MAGA. I give you that.
I’ll move towards you one step. Both of course texted and sent emails inside their wider swamp-networks, potentially “perhaps 50,000” times, all in all. In the important highly heated eventful post election day early Trump days. No less.
Some of those mails may prove that Russiagate is really Hillarygate AND also deeply linked to Obamagate: HillaryObamaGate. Meaning: they didn’t need to spent all their energy on their love-affair ‘cum’ Trump-hate, but had to keep the wider network informed too? Save evidence: There were traces to this effect.
Sorry, but this is a déjà vu dive back into a close-up US partisan popular culture clash experience, I prefer to not be reminded of. Meaning: I do feel the need to keep it at arms-length. And maybe that’s why I gladly took your offer to look at cold numbers. At the time, I surely prayed for some type of cold type of helpful, clarifying, technical SIGINT, admittedly. … Felt like the only way out.
But thanks for offering the helping hand. 😉
*********
Somehow I seem to prefer to look into Cyber-rules and debates as mirrored here. What rules was the “conspiracy parties” guided by at the time? Feeling the need to put matters into context.
http://publications.armywarcollege.edu/sitesearch.cfm?q=Cyber
RE: 50000 text messages.
Can anyone shed some light on how this number has been reached? I ask as text messages are 160 characters in length and messages longer than this, while shown as a single message on the handset, will still be broken down into these 160 character messages.
Rhondda,
Title 18 U.S. Code, section 2384, is a nice, vague criminal law from the standpoint of the government or a prosecutor, and includes that broadest doctrine of all — conspiracy — but the problem with trying to use it against those who have been seeking to push down Gen. Michael Flynn, Trump, et. al., is that each of the five alternative elements requires either “by force” or “to levy war”–
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2384
The devious villains who have been running this attempt to remove Trump and to neutralize the complaints of the “deplorables” are using the existing legal and media structure to try to do it. In fact, one of the elements of 18 U.S. Code 2384 is that the conspiracy to do one of the five alternative elements has to be done “contrary to the authority thereof [of the U.S. government]”. When the backstabbing Deputy Attorney General, Rod Rosenstein, wrote the directive establishing the “special counsel” Robert Mueller, he created a sub-office that has the authority of the U.S. government.
Pretty slick.
Two points: my nose tells me that there is at least a 50/50 chance that that there were communications between Mueller, Rosenstein and Comey relating to Mueller’s appointment before Comey leaked the triggering material to the NYT by washing it through his friend, the law professor at Columbia; point 2 – there is almost no chance whatever, given the alleged overseas sourcing cited in the Steele materials, that there isn’t heavy CIA involvement, inclusive of the very political Brennan, in assessing those materials for use. The FBI has no investigative capabilities in Russia and it would have been irresponsible for the FBI to move with that information without at least consulting with the Agency for corroborative support.
We are past the point where Christopher Wray should be requesting an independent investigation into this mess, whether it comes from the USAtty’s Office in DC or another Special Counsel that would have the authority to pre empt Mueller – the FBI is hemorrhaging Integrity. The only thing that will stem the flow is to get to the bottom of the mess and a post Watergate Style root and branch reform.
I hate to throw a technical wrench in the way of such a massive conspiracy, however the FBI does not run its own cell phone service, and thus does not have ultimate control over this data. This is a piggyback collection system that failed, not the real database. Whatever major carrier they were contracted with has the full records going back a year, probably more. Fox is reporting that the glitch affected 10% of all cell phones at the FBI, but given how this stuff works, I don’t imagine that they can’t get a backup of the records reasonably quickly. Fox mentions that as well.
First off Sid, I am definitely not a Russiagate partisan. Second, I asked a question. I got an answer from PT. I did not produce an argument, let alone a classic one, either from ignorance or not.
Doesn’t backstabbing count as force? Just kidding.
“If two or more persons in any State or Territory, or in any place subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, conspire to overthrow, put down, or to destroy by force the Government of the United States, or to levy war against them, or to oppose by force the authority thereof, or by force to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of any law of the United States, or by force to seize, take, or possess any property of the United States contrary to the authority thereof, they shall each be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than twenty years, or both.”
I had looked this up at Cornell earlier and it seemed to me there might be opportunities for strong prosecution in the areas I have bolded, above.
From reading the FISC memos, it appears to me they may have also broken a number of serious laws with regard to use of 702, unmasking, etc. 5 years here, 10 years there and we’re talking serious time…
That said, I am not a lawyer nor do I play one on TV. This is way beyond my paygrade, as the saying goes.
I guess mostly I am just so completely outraged by this that I WANT these people to roast over a slow prosecutorial fire with serious consequences. Smokin’ that hopium. Sadly, the rot may be too deep for what seem to me to be appropriate consequences.
Thank you for your reply. I always read and respect your comments.
Oh goodness, I just re-read what I bolded in my reply and I finally see what you mean — force, force, force. Thank you for gently pushing me. I appreciate that.
I guess our founding fathers and lawmakers of earlier times must never have thought to include a provision for those guilty of a “soft coup.”
Yes. Pretty dang slick.
Flavius,
“Comey leaked the triggering material to the NYT by washing it through his friend, the law professor at Columbia…”
The “friend” is now claiming to be Comey’s personal attorney. Thus he can claim attorney-client priveledge and Comey can explain why he used the word “friend” rather than “my personal attorney” in his testimony before Congress. I can’t image the members of the House are all too pleased with Slick
Willy 2Jimmy or the good professor.LeaNder,
North Korea, The Peoples Republic of China, The Russian Federation and many other nations are not denziens of “the Swamp”. Nice try though.
“but this is a déjà vu dive back into a close-up US partisan popular culture clash experience, I prefer to not be reminded of.”
Yeah, the great ’60s cultural liberation movements that would inaugurate the Age of Aquarius are finally experiencing some cultural blow-back as exemplified by Trump’s election. How’s that working out in Germany? Has Angela formed a new government? I can’t imagine why that hasn’t happened yet.
If a woman will cheat with you, she will cheat on you.
President Trump has agreed to be interviewed by special counsel Mueller under oath while reiterating that there was no collusion. Is this the set-up for the wind-up of the Mueller probe?
I am speculating on such an outcome for two reasons. One, if there was a shred of evidence on the alleged collusion it would have been leaked a long time ago. Second, it is getting too hot in the kitchen as more of the conspiracy gets uncovered and Mueller does not have clean hands due to his role in several investigations including UraniumOne and his close associations with a number of people including Comey who was his deputy at the FBI.
Amen, Sid Finster. Nailed it.
Col., et. al:
I recall Admiral Rogers’ visit to Trump Tower during the transition period really chapped quite a few asses. If I remember correctly, Rogers was pilloried in the press afterwards–to include recommendations/claims by Brennan and Clapper he be fired.
It always struck me as odd. But the swiftness in which the hammer came down on him his “secret trip” definitely raised a few question marks. Logically, It seems that if there were any shenanigans going on that would have likely been the time T-money was apprised of the goings on. I actually went back and looked, and the very next day the whole Trump transition was moved from NYC to NJ. It seems more likely than not?
But I’m sure there are plenty of reasons DIRNSA would meet with the President-elect and there is also the issue of chain of command, but the anger directed at Rogers seemed disproportionate to his actions.
Anyone have a feel on this?
Here is a brutal, and unfortunately truthful, description of the role of tribal membership in the ongoing American scandal: http://www.unz.com/article/its-time-to-drop-the-jew-taboo/
“McCabe is being allowed to hang on at the FBI on the taxpayer dime until March so that he can collect his pension.”
Was not he involved in the conspiracy? Also, seems that dignity is sompletely outside McCabe’ realm
Mark,
You are correct. It was an appropriate question and you did nothing untoward.Ma
To paraphrase what blue peacock has written here and I strongly recommend you read his posts and the time line he put together.
Admiral Rogers discovered FISA violations and unauthorized access to raw data. He ordered a compliance review at the NSA. The result of this review showed many violations. He went personally to the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court and reported these violations. This happened October 2016. A week after the election, he went to Trump Tower without informing DNI Clapper and informed Trump about the surveillance and probably the violations that were uncovered by the compliance review at the NSA. The next day Trump moved his whole transition team to Bedminster.
Clapper and Brennan must have been furious because Admiral Rogers let the cat out of the bag and Trump knew what had happened and what was going on. That’s why they wanted his head but Obama probably was too scared to pull the trigger and then have Admiral Rogers testify to Congress. Recall Trump’s tweet that Obama had wiretapped him and how he was derided for that by the media and the establishment. Trump knew because of Admiral Rogers.
’60s cultural liberation movements
That’s not what it reminds me of. Something more recent and completely unrelated on US ground.
I do not think the baby boomers brought evil over the world. But I am aware that I am in a minority with this position here.
LeaNder,
I agree that American boomers did not bring the brave new world to old Europe, that was done by Europeans. How’s that working out for you?
By the way Col, did you happen to see Chuck Scarborough this AM (Jan 25th)on Morning Joe mocking Trey Gowdy’s southern accent? I found this very interesting….can you imagine if someone had mocked an inner city accent? Or a Chinese accent? And so on……
Lets see if he called out on it.
Perhaps it is Nunes who needs super-protection right now.
John Kerry also part of the “secret society”? Reported that he told the Palestinians to not pay attention to Trump and that Trump would be gone within a year: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2018/01/25/john-kerry-reportedly-coaches-palestinians-not-to-yield-to-trump-in-peace-talks-spurring-backlash.html
Appreciated !
jonst,
I saw that. [morning] Joe and Mika might as well just hang a sign around their necks reading, “I am Borg”.
They have descended into full drunken clown mode; them and their brow beating guest talking heads. [according to them] it’s so damaging to the image of the US to accuse the FBI of plotting to get rid of Trump. Such a crazy conspiracy theory! Inconceivable! Only a crazy idiot would buy into it! Contemptible! And then they turn around in the same breath and state that Trump was colluding with the monstrous Russians to undermine the democratic processes.
The lack of self-awareness is stunning.
Some relevant news:
The missing text messages from a critical five-month period between Trump-bashing FBI officials Peter Strzok and Lisa Page, who both served on Special Counsel Robert Mueller’s team, have been located by the Department of Justice.
In a letter sent to congressional committees, Justice Department Inspector General Michael Horowitz said his office “succeeded in using forensic tools to recover text messages from FBI devices, including text messages between Mr. Strzok and Ms. Page that were sent or received between December 14, 2016 and May 17, 2017.”
Horowitz sent his letter confirming the discovery of texts to Senate Homeland Security Committee Chairman Ron Johnson, R-Wis., and Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Chuck Grassley, R-Iowa, who had inquired about the messages.
“Our effort to recover any additional text messages is ongoing,” Horowitz added quoted by Fox News. “We will provide copies of the text messages that we recover from these devices to the Department so that the Department’s leadership can take any management action it deems appropriate.”
Walrus,
( reply to comment 8),
Since the NSA gathers EVERYthing communicated over electronic media . . . so far as I know . . . . then it stands to reason that the NSA intercepts stored at Fort Sweep-It-All-Up should contain this several month’s bunch of FBI-related texts. So if they have been “erased” everywhere else, they should still exist in the NSA vaults.
Colonel,
On an off topic event, according to Robert David Steele the Hawaii alert incident was a real missile intercept.
Hawaii has 5 levels of fail-safe in their missile protection system. A tourist boat saw missile pieces falling into the sea.
The point of origin appears to be the Guam region which would be sea based launch.
Now the 64 dollar question, who did it and what type of inbound. What is interesting is that both the Clinton’s and Obama’s were in Hawaii at the time, which makes good alibis.
Some are hypothesizing that this has an Israeli involvement, say one of their subs. Would Israel do a USS Liberty part two? There’s no doubt Israel would. If Israel thought it was in their interest, Israel would try and nuke U.S.
As I predicted (and believe me, I’m not doing a victory lap on this), it took all of a day for IG to get the records. They said they did it using “forensic” tools, which I’m guessing just means they retrieved a regularly archived version of the data.
I’m sorry, but this was not a story.
Do they only work 9-5 or do they have the French 36 hour work week with extended holidays?
Ok, Fred, considering you are an old SST friend. One more note.
Do they only work 9-5 or do they have the French 36 hour work week with extended holidays?
Yes, strictly I wondered if forensic evidence based on, let’s say, one factor like St. Petersburg work hours makes sense.
I like your analysis. I’m a person who grew up and became Democrat because of Kennedy. I disapproved of the Vietnam War and its effects on the young men of my generation.
I remained a Democrat despite the fact that I hated the sex, drugs, and rock and roll culture and the entire “flower power” movement, which seemed more in line with the Democrats.
It was a long time coming, but I finally gave up the Democratic Party because it was impossible to accept Obama and then Hillary.
It’s been a long journey, one that causes me some embarrassment when I think of my past political beliefs.
What encourages me the most, however, are all the friends and family members now who have gone through the same metamorphosis. We sit around wondering how we could have been so wrong. So, our newer political beliefs are more tenuous. We think and re-think them.
Here is the one belief system that I believe allowed me finally to change my political belief system: my sincere and lifelong religious belief. My Sunday school training, confirmations school classes, my English studies, which all helped deepen my Christian beliefs.
When I was young and dumb, the Democrats seemed to be the people who were “more Christian.” It took a long time and much piling up of evidence to see clearly that they use that veil of being “good” to trick and to cover their real beliefs.
I do not doubt that there are many Democrats who are people as I was in the past, good people who think their policies are good but who are unaware of how many of those policies are really harmful to people they want to help and are developed for the purpose not of helping people but for simply keeping them under the party’s control.