"“I am confident that such coincidences require serious analysis and an investigation.”
On September 19, a humanitarian convoy consisting of 31 trucks was attacked while heading to Aleppo. According to the Red Cross, 20 civilians and one aid worker died as a result. Initial reports by the organization claimed the convoy had been targeted by an airstrike.
On Tuesday, the UN backtracked on its earlier claims that the convoy was hit by military planes.
"We are not in a position to determine whether these were in fact airstrikes. We are in a position to say that the convoy was attacked," UN humanitarian spokesman Jens Laerke said.
Speaking on the delivery of humanitarian aid to Syria, Lavrov said that the Russia and US-backed plan included the creation of a demilitarized zone around the Castello Road near Aleppo. The minister added that while the Syrian government forces have started their withdrawal, the militants have not followed suit." AMN
————–
Pilgrims! I don't know what you see in this photo of the convoy attack site but I do not see evidence of an air attack unless the air weapon was something very precise like an armed UAV.
There is no blast damage on the roadway itself. There are no pieces of the exploded or unexploded ordnance itself. The overhead power lines are uncut. There does not seem to be damage to nearby structures.
What I see is a burned truck. pl
The UN said it heard about the attack while it was unfolding yet is unable to determine where the attack came from (land or or air). Which is fishy.
My guess is Al Nusra who was active in the area at the time did this and the White Helmets turned it into agitprop for the West.
Col.,
“What I see is a burned truck.”
It is also conveniently parked at the side of the road.
What kind of explosion is this, in the first second of the video?
Does not look like your average HE. What kind of bomb or missile is it? Looks like metallic fragments burning.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQnKEhHb4Iw
The Colonel Cassad blog has many photos of the attacked convoy that may provide more insight into the weapons used to attack the convoy:
http://colonelcassad.livejournal.com/?skip=10
RT is also reporting that:
“The Russian Defense Ministry says that a US coalition drone was in the vicinity of a humanitarian convoy when it was attacked outside Aleppo. According to the Russian military, the unmanned aircraft was a Predator drone”:
https://www.rt.com/news/360165-us-drone-syria-russia/
It doesn’t matter does it? “….one can’t believe impossible things.” “I daresay you haven’t had much practice,” said the Queen. “When I was your age, I always did it for half-an-hour a day. Why, sometimes I’ve believed as many as six impossible things before breakfast.”
On NPR news and then BBC news last night, I heard that this WAS an airstrike and most likely a RUSSIAN air strike. Both allegedly “public” news outlets made VERY SURE that we-the-audience knew ALL ABOUT the TWO SUKHOI JETS seen “in the area” at the same exact time as the AIR STRIKE HAPPENED.
And this morning ” American accuses Russia and Russia furiously denies it” etc.\
This is a public audience mass-mind-molding operation for conflict, possibly war, with Russia. It is timed very conveniently to coincide with the “Russia hacks our Democracy” meme and the “Trump is Putin’s agent” meme. Both these memes are being driven by the Clintonite Democratic Party and its Class Collaborators throughout the Big Media.
Many of us here have so far been finding Trump too distasteful to actually vote for even though we won’t be voting for Clinton. But is it premature to begin wondering whether the Obamacrat Regime and its follow-on Clintonite-Regime-in-waiting pose such a clear and present danger of the outbreak of serious war that we ought to consider discussing the possibility that perhaps we should all vote for Trump just to make very sure that Her Imperial Borgess and all her little henchcreeps cannot get their big gracefully-long-fingered hands anywhere near the “button”?
The following report echo’s the Colonel’s observations and adds more details.
Also, FWIW, an FB correspondent of mine claims that she spoke to relatives in Aleppo who claim they saw no attack.
The question is: can it be used to take the US to a no-fly zone, and thus to war. In my view, it has turned out to be too weak. Whatever the desires, they need something better to justify bombing the sh*t out of the Syrians.
You nailed my thinking on it. I hit that point a while ago however. It gets clearer to me every day that is the only option.
To see the US walking back on this, after Power jumped at a primetime chance to lecture them, and right on the heels of the airstrikes the US made “by mistake”… Putin & co have got to be fuming, they’ve done this kind of JV bs in the past and he takes it as personally insulting.
Not an area I know but is there any significance to their carrier departing to the Med? From this it looks like mostly a gesture:
http://nationalinterest.org/blog/the-buzz/russias-only-aircraft-carrier-headed-syria-suffers-one-big-17756
Someone elsewhere suggested a AGM-114N Hellfire II which has a metal augmented charge warhead.
There is video footage of the convoy unloading before sunset – this was taken by one of the drones the Russians set up to allow live monitoring of the ceasefire on YouTube so it’s possible they don’t know what they have. Go 58 minutes in.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egwLxk-ypKk
It looks like they set it up by pointing a webcam at a monitor showing the output from the drone so the quality’s not great. This shows that the warehouse is located here:
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@36.1515516,36.9677753,263m/data=!3m1!1e3
ghostship
Do the Russians have Hellfire missiles? pl
There is no more shock value to these incidents, staged or otherwise. We are all numb after endless war. The outrage expressed by one side or another is just part of a manufactured PR system. I am puzzled they missed placing a child near the truck as a prop. The UN just a hs debate stage for the wonks. In a war we have no business to be in, what is a good strike versus a bad one?
Our men and women are no longer fighting for the stars and stripes. They have been turned mercenaries for our so called allies in exchange for donations to our political class. ‘Where is Aleppo’ should be the definition of sanity. Sorry, I am tired.
Col. Lang,
John McCreary had a field day with this in his nightly bulletin.
“For us, the most interesting and important points of the denial defense are the way the Russians made a case for a totally different explanation for the damage. They not only denied the US accusations, they raised questions about the competence of US intelligence by implying that it missed the real cause of the damage – a ground action initiated by the al Nusra Front terrorists.”
Best,
Eliot
http://theduran.com/sergey-lavrov-calls-americas-bluff-russia-wants-full-impartial-investigation-aleppo-un-convoy-attack/
Umm al Kubra is a rebel held village near Idlib….. The entire pre-war population of 5,000 was either exterminated, or fled. Only jihadists are there at this time.
This locale has been the site of many propaganda pieces including those purporting to show children killed/wounded by the SAA.
The convoy in question was bannered “UNICEF” and the trucks were different, too.
As the Russians have said, the only evidence visible in the photos is that of burned trucks. There is no evidence of high explosive detonation eg: from bomb, missile, shell.
The timing could not have been more convenient, could it.. shortly after the US/NATO got caught with it’s pants down over the Der El Azzor attack…
What I don’t understand is why the 6+1 (Syria, Russia, Iran, Iraq, Hezbollah) don’t impose a “No Fly Zone” over Syria for all aircraft other than those explicitly following agreed mission profiles.
I also don’t understand why the Syrians allow humanitarian convoys of any kind other than those they operate.
I also don’t understand why the Syrians don’t tell the US/NATO to their face that the SAA is out to kill all the Whabbists…… and starving them to death is as good a way to achieve this as any……..
INDY
Umm al Kubra is a rebel held village near Idlib….. The entire pre-war population of 5,000 was either exterminated, or fled. Only jihadists are there at this time.
This locale has been the site of many propaganda pieces including those purporting to show children killed/wounded by the SAA.
The convoy in question was bannered “UNICEF” and the trucks were different, too.
As the Russians have said, the only evidence visible in the photos is that of burned trucks. There is no evidence of high explosive detonation eg: from bomb, missile, shell.
The timing could not have been more convenient, could it.. shortly after the US/NATO got caught with it’s pants down over the Der El Azzor attack…
What I don’t understand is why the 6+1 (Syria, Russia, Iran, Iraq, Hezbollah) don’t impose a “No Fly Zone” over Syria for all aircraft other than those explicitly following agreed mission profiles.
I also don’t understand why the Syrians allow humanitarian convoys of any kind other than those they operate.
I also don’t understand why the Syrians don’t tell the US/NATO to their face that the SAA is out to kill all the Whabbists…… and starving them to death is as good a way to achieve this as any……..
INDY
Thanks. Your comment is reassuring. The first thing I thought was that this was a revenge on white trucks by Nice policemen. And now, instead of feeling like an idiot, I’m feeling rather royal.
Then again, making jokes when Col. Lang is with the black panther’s mood is even more idiotic than thinking about Nice policemen and white trucks. I guess I’m hopeless. Royally hopeless, that is.
Probably not in terms of a precision guided weapon that can be fired from a UAV.
The closest equivalent is probably the 9M120F Ataka which uses a thermobaric warhead. The person who made the comment elsewhere pointed out that Russian thermobaric weapons don’t use fine metal particles so there was no sparkle effect. The Ataka can be launched from the M-28 Havoc attack helicopter but as yet the Russians appear to have no attack drones like the Predator or Reaper.
Colonel,
Seems the boys at CIA are having a bit of problems with their shippments8 to their Jihadi buddies
Jordanian Intelligence stole and sold on black market weapons shipped to Syria rebels by CIA
http://yalibnan.com/2016/06/27/jordanian-intelligence-stole-and-sold-on-black-market-weapons-shipped-to-syria-rebels-by-cia/
The Russian MoD has released this video, which it maintains is an off-road vehicle equipped with a large-caliber mortar launcher.
https://m.sputniknews.com/middleeast/20160920/1045521488/aleppo-un-convoy.html
The BS out behind the barn isn’t stacked as high as this story’s.
But I think my favourite is that thy could clearly see a barrel bomb being pushed out the back of a helicopter in the middle of the night. Are the white helmets now equipped with night vision goggles? Even if they were? This story doesn’t pass the smell test any more than that pile out behind the barn.
DC and 11B
I’m exactly where you guys are. There may be no option but vote for Trump. The Borg Queen will only escalate what Obummer is doing right now with the agitprop. A very dangerous trajectory is being pursued by the Borg.
The AT-16 is the closest that they have, but only the KA-52 uses it.
The BORG has spoken – Kerry calls for no fly zone
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/sep/21/syria-un-aid-airstrike-russia-boris-johnson
Smells like this indeed, let’s hope it’s only a warm up for an “October Surprise”.
BBC has some photos but provenance is uncertain.
The trucks that are shown have no body distortion, the burnt truck skeletons show no bulging or distortion and no ribs appear to be missing.
Half way down the page there is a photo of a crater surrounded by boxes.
About 1 meter deep crater and the boxes on the edge are basically intact and unburnt. Appears that the boxes were stacked around an existing crater. Make your own judgement.
BTW. caption on the photo “Pictures appear to show at least one crater, contradicting Russia’s assertion that there are none”
Oh, look, a crater, must be Russian. Clinton really wants her no fly zone ASAP.
Exactly so. It reminds me of the MH17 shootdown. Russia was established as the villain of the piece before anyone knew what happened. Yesterday evening on UK radio they wheeled out this guy:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tim_Cross
to give us all a lecture about how Putin and Russians in general are “brutal thugs” who “lie all the time”.
As far as the convoy itself goes, my sympathy is considerably diminished by the fact that they were transporting weapons. If you play with fire you get burned.
The looking glass is becoming transparent
The Pentagon is specifically claiming that a Russian Su-24 was overhead at the exact time that the convoy was bombed and saying that the Russians did it …
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/us-other-nations-say-syrian-cease-fire-is-not-dead-despite-heavy-fighting/2016/09/20/ed7a9bc8-7f44-11e6-9070-5c4905bf40dc_story.html
So the Pentagon is putting their credibility on the line, not that they have to release any records.
Here is a side view of one of the destroyed trucks, possibly the same one pictured above. In any case, the truck looks like it was neatly burned to me with absolutely no damage to the road. If no one told me what happened, I would think that fuel was poured over and in the container. Even the infrastructure frame of the container is intact, only the container walls are burned away. It doesn’t even look like it was hit by force except possibly in the front the then burned after that.
https://img.washingtonpost.com/rf/image_1024w/2010-2019/WashingtonPost/2016/09/20/National-Security/Images/Mideast_Syria-b87b6-0483.jpg?uuid=8FYXon9bEeaNE9fHBO-f2Q
“It reminds me of the MH17 shootdown. Russia was established as the villain of the piece before anyone knew what happened.”
Then you have a very selective memory. It was the official quite nonsensical RUSSIAN version that a Ukranian ground support aircraft had fired the missile, which destroyed MH-17.
This version had only been binned just before the official result was leaked. Why this stupid charade when the BUG launcher would have been Ukranian? It only made sense when the “rebels” had screwed up.
All:
Interview with President Assad:
https://www.yahoo.com/news/full-transcript-ap-interview-syrian-president-assad-111307874.html
FYI, here is William Engdahl view on the raison d’etre for the syrian war.
The Syrian Pipeline War: How Russia Trumped USA Energy War in the Mideast
There is a crucial hydrocarbon component to the great power contest in and around Syria says F. William Engdahl
http://russia-insider.com/en/russia-trumps-usa-energy-war-mideast-httpjournal-neoorg20160917russia-trumps-usa-energy-war-mideast?utm_source=Russia+Insider+Daily+Headlines&utm_campaign=a05699c49f-Russia_Insider_Daily_Headlines11_21_2014&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_c626db089c-a05699c49f-227220333&ct=t%28Russia_Insider_Daily_Headlines11_21_2014%29&mc_cid=a05699c49f&mc_eid=f37f24023e
Mostly, but not entirely, off topic: RFK’s legislative assistant and speechwriter Adam Walinsky announces he’s going to vote for Donald Trump.
http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/09/rfk-trump-2016-democratic-party-speechwriter-214270
Congrats, you really are a dedicated European Borgist.
you may have put your finger on it. The burning metallic fragment could well have been phosphorous. The only kind of air weapon that is generally available that could do this are phosphorous bombs that would ignite the vehicles without causing substantial damage to them
The Borg is going all out. Things must be getting hot and heavy.
Leaked text of US-Syria ceasefire plan
http://www.timesofisrael.com/leaked-text-of-us-russia-syria-ceasefire-deal/
I agree that it is definitely not a strike using conventional bombs with HE. At first I was thinking Willie Peter or napalm.
But there is an incendiary cluster munition, which seems more likely and has been used in Syria in the past. The ZAB-2.5 comes in thermite only, or thermite/jellied-fuel variant, or thermite/HE variant. They (or a hybrid form) could have been the culprit in the convoy truck burnings like they did. If so, there should be spent casings of the bomblets laying around the area. But I would not want to investigate as unexploded ones could be dangerous.
https://rogueadventurer.com/2012/11/27/update-cluster-munitions-in-syria-zab-2-5-incendiary-submunitions/
“It only made sense when the “rebels” had screwed up.”
Then let NATO, masters of global spectrum dominance, provide the public with the proof.
“Skat” on the way: Russia’s Armed Forces to Receive Strike Drones in 2016.
https://southfront.org/skat-on-the-way-troops-will-receive-strike-drones/
The Russian’s released drone video showing the jihadi’s using the cover of the Aid Convoy, to move a 4×4 pickup with a “hell cannon” in the back.
The “Hell Cannons” are improvised 335.6 mm mortars that fire a used 20lb propane tank, filled with homemade amatol, and often fused with a defective RPG.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Vx8EaPr6C0I
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=MLRTsp1O5WU
Check out the “sparkle effect” and the large fireball, probably caused by clumping and a diesel rich amatol mix.
I thought it was a very sensible article, but… WOW(!) incredible amount of anti-Trump hysteria in the comments. Nary a rational expression of thoughts in sight.
“Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.” https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extraordinary_Popular_Delusions_and_the_Madness_of_Crowds
THis website maintains that Russian weapons hit the convoy – https://www.bellingcat.com/news/mena/2016/09/22/russian-bomb-remains-recovered-syrian-red-crescent-aid-convoy-attack/
I’m not equipped to evaluate it.
As a diversion, at the Nation, we have
‘A group of 150 Syrian intellectuals, composed mostly of writers, artists, academics, and journalists, all identifying themselves as secular democratic opponents of the Syrian regime, have issued the statement below to express their condemnation of the role played by both Washington and Moscow in their country. …’
https://www.thenation.com/article/syrian-writers-artists-and-journalists-speak-out-against-us-and-russian-policy/
Given the robust terms in which they condemn USA and Russia, it seems a curious omission that apart from Iran, they don’t mention any other nations that have been involved- Saudi Arabia, Turkey and the Gulf nations get off free.
Interesting that you can characterise yourselves as ‘secular democratic’ while ignoring the role of Sunni extremism in making Syria what it is today. It’s not what these people say, but what they don’t say that raises my b/s detector to red.
My first thought was as most of yours, a false flag to build a propaganda case for a no-fly zone. But a couple of things are of interest; ‘unfortunately’ the Russian drone did not capture that attack, then they released the footage of the imbedded heavy towed mortar. I think it is probable that the convoy was carrying weapons and ammo, which is a fairly easy call as the convoy originated in Turkey and they wouldn’t let the Syrian government search the vehicles. It is quite possible the Russians watched the weapons unload, then bombed the warehouse and struck at the gathering concentrations of rats preparing for their assault (which came soon after from exactly the same region). The Yanks can’t release their evidence, as it shows the ‘aid’ convoy was military (which the Russians were telling us by releasing the mortar footage), and the Russians can’t release their evidence even though they legitimately attacked a logistics train; the truth is not on their side in the face of the MSM and sociopathic US spokespeople.
I actually hope this is true, after the Deir al-Zour massacre it is time to take the gloves off and extend the claws.
The photos are from the White Helmets. Eliott Higgins/Brown Moses/Bellingcat wanted some additional “evidence” so he called up his mates in the White Helmets and they went back and took additional photographs for him. The new photograph included the hole in the roof the bomb came through.
He does identify the bomb as an OFAB 250-270, which is described as an high-explosive fragmentation bomb with 92 kilos of high explosive.
Correct me if I’m wrong but I thought the whole point of fragmentation bombs was not to bury them in the ground before exploding as then all those fragments are wasted. Instead, ideally they should detonate just before they hit the ground so I’m surprised that it punched a hole in the roof, buried itself a couple of feet into the ground through more concrete and then exploded. I would have expected it to detonate when it first hit the roof.
Even if the fuses malfunctioned and it didn’t detonate until it hit the concrete floor in the warehouse I would expect there to be little or nothing left of the boxes.
I’m not equipped to evaluate it.
I’m not sure that Eliott Higgins/Brown Moses/Bellingcat is equipped to evaluate anything. Before he was a weapons analyst, he was bank clerk and stock controller for a women’s underwear company.
BTW, in that article he claims that the bomb he identifies, the OFAB 250-270, was/is only manufactured in the Soviet Union/Russia when it was/is in fact also manufactured in most of the Warsaw Pact countries (Bulgaria and Romania is as far as I’ve checked). That Soviet weapons were also manufactured in Warsaw Pact countries should be understood by him, that he appears not to could be because it doesn’t fit the message he is trying to deliver which seems to be relentlessly anti-Russian.
He was behind much of the “evidence” of the use of chemical weapons by the Syrian government in Ghouta which could have caused a major expansion in the war.
He is quoted in an article over at The Daily Beast by Pierre Vaux which claims that it is already fully proven from social media that Russia carried out the attack on the SARC convoy.
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/09/21/this-is-how-russia-bombed-the-un-convoy.html
Ulenspiegel, Kerry intoned that the U.S. saw where the missile was fired from and its flight path within a day (or two of the incident), since then the U.S. State Dept has refused to release any of the satellite imagery or data that might have been used to back up Kerry’s immediate assertion. Why not release the data?
The Dutch investigation concluded that it was a Buk missile and then calculated and area where it originated from that included both Ukrainian army and rebel held territory. The Ukrainian army has Buk missile launchers and in those days they were on high alert because they were worried about a possible invasion by Russia and one of their Jets had been shot down. So maybe they made the mistake instead of the rebels.
In any case, I get suspicious when the U.S. denies a simple request for data for no apparent reason.
Dear Colonel,
Apparently, Russia reached their internal red line for Kerry/Obama BS.
http://www.fort-russ.com/2016/09/lavrov-makes-history-ceasefires-were.html
Wondering why Obama approved sabotaging the cease fire (or not rolled heads for not following his directives). Seems to me if it had held, it would have helped the election and his legacy. Agent of Russia has already been fired at Trump and not had any notable effect in the polling.
My best guess is that someone in the line of command is pre-positioning themselves as for the next administration, knowing there is no backbone above and thus no risk.
There is some evidence that the rebels believed they had shot down a Ukrainian military transport aircraft which they then denied and that the Ukrainian irregular forces believed that Putin was flying over the area. Did either party intentionally shoot it down knowing it was only a civilian aircraft – I doubt it but the more important question, who was responsible for the safety of that aircraft, is rarely asked, because the Borg, etc. are unwilling to admit it was the Ukrainian government and not the rebels. Ukraine should have shut the eastern part of their airspace to civilian aircraft once heavy SAMs were introduced to the battlefield.
Thanks.
Ghostship already traced the convoy to have, in fact, passed from Damascus up through govt.-held territory to western Halab, and from there to that unicorn staging area:
http://turcopolier.typepad.com/sic_semper_tyrannis/2016/09/what-happened-to-the-red-crescent-convoy.html
“Ghostship said in reply to Chris Chuba…
The convoy originated in Damascus where it loaded up from a UN warehouse, drove through government held territory to Aleppo and then crossed from western Aleppo (city) into the western Aleppo (governorate) which is held by rebels. Having monitored he load the Russians/Syrians knew exactly what was on those trucks so why bomb them when they could have delayed the crossing into rebel territory by a few hours to wait and see what happened with the ceasefire.
It’s difficult to see what the motive of the Russians or Syrians for bombing the convoy could be. One that might make sense is that the Russians claimed they lost contact with the convoy after it crossed into rebel territory and that some Syrian agent reported the arrival of a suspicious convoy resulting in the attack. US officials are claiming that there were two Russian Su-24s overhead at the time of the attack, so we can exclude Syrian involvement. But after Saturdays windfall, I doubt the Russians would want to jeopardise that advantage by attacking an unknown convoy in an area where a known convoy has just arrived.”
This does not rule out that a separate, true gun-run converged on exactly that point where the SARC-convoy stopped over, however I do not think one needs to mind the “activists”‘s and Kerry’s claims too much, especially given the rather flimsical “evidence” the former produced. When Kerry pointed the finger at the “constantly changing Russian story”, he conveniently messed up the order of announcements made by the RU/SY-side and forgets to acknowledge that the “activists” on the spot kept changing theirs even worse – from “air-strike” by jets to “barrel-bombing helicopters” to “land-missile”.
It’s already a shaky foundation to construe as the last straw toward a NFZ which not even the UN appears to be buying, and that Kerry and US-Admin. are so blatant about it – as per Gen. Dunford it would of course only apply to RU/SY air-forces, not the US – it won’t go anywhere. Especially since both RU and SY just had about enough of the shenanigans the unicorns get up to in Halab city, it appears:
https://twitter.com/sayed_ridha/status/779034137030111232
One is left to wonder what sort of outrage shall be fabricated as eastern Halab city is liberated.
On second thought, this video does appear to show that it was more than just burned out trucks. I still didn’t see craters but there does appear to be some shrapnel damage. And many of the trucks were overturned by the blast or blown off the road.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qM9x9h4Mb8E
I am not familiar with ‘News Front’. Is that a Russian media outfit?
Mind the date, it’s from January.
Also compare that to the pictures taken of the “air-struck” UN-convoy.
One observation is the speed, and the homogeneity of the news of the convoy bombing reached all the worlds MSM quickly, with the meme Russia did it.
Reminds me of the boy in the chair.
Reminds me of the boy on the beach.
Reminds me of the Ghouta Sarin (?) attack.
Corrections and doubts are published later, after the public consciousness has been set.
Me thinks there is a media coordination center behind it, but not sure how to prove it.