“Committee Chairman Rep. Bennie Thompson presented a recorded video of some of the individuals who stormed the Capitol Thursday night.
One man said he had “supported Trump all that time. I did believe that the election was being stolen and Trump asked us to come. He personally asked for us to come to D.C. that day, and I thought, for everything he’s done for us…”
Another individual said Trump mentioned going to the Capitol during his Jan. 6, 2021 speech ahead of the riot, and said that one of his “disappointments” was that Trump said “he was going to go with us, that he was going to be there.”
Thompson, closing the two-hour-long hearing, said that the committee will reconvene next week and “examine the lies that convinced those men and others to storm the Capitol, to try to stop the transfer of power.”
“We’re going to take a close look at the first part of Trump’s attack on the rule of law, when he hit the fuse that ultimately resulted in the violence of January 6, without objection,” Thompson said. ” Foxnews
“Section 3. No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof….” text of 14th Amendment
Comment: The 6 January Committee has IMO already decided to declare Trump to be an insurrectionist and to refer him to the DoJ with a recommendation for prosecution as such. The object will be to prevent him running again for president. This may well work as Garland is likely to cooperate. pl
January 6 hearings: Watch congressional hearings live | Live Updates from Fox News Digital
Garland will cooperate. He was put in the DOIJ to cooperate. The FIB “appears” to have been involved in Jan. 6th. Couple this w/t willingness to make 5AM raids on political opponents, a compliant media, a Ministry of Truth and it is hard not to call this fascism. Many wonder how Stalin gained complete control over Russia. He did it by controlling every gov’t office, agency, etc., and enforced his will by threat of death. Today’s HC is no more than a Star Court, a show trial sold to an apathetic public by a cooperative media. Americans don’t understand, our Republic is in trouble. There was conversation on another thread about whether Ukraine or Russia is in an existential situation. We are in an existential situation right now. Are the Sons of Liberty still active? Perhaps there is a chapter in Virginia or New York.
Good. Let the discovery begin.
From the little I’ve learned about the events in the past two years I’d say they have a good case. In the sense of a case at law. The politics? I’m hoping and half guessing that people are tired of this by now. There are various cranks around who are prophecy the end of our republic due to the 2024 election. I do not wish them well and hope that people come to their senses.
F&L
Given that of the now 800 people arrested in connection with the Capitol breach on January 6th exactly zero have been charged under 18 U.S. Code § 2383, you don’t think Trump’s defense counsel might be tempted to paraphrase Ginsberg: What if someone incited an insurrection and nobody came? But of course there is always the possibility that the Orange Devil will be found guilty of engaging in a one man insurrection.
Barbara Ann,
Over a dozen have been charged with 18 US Code § 2384 (seditious conspiracy). Three have already plead guilty. Tying Trump to that seditious conspiracy doesn’t seem like too much of a reach.
TTG
I’m sure you know as well as I do that conspiracy is the lawyer’s fallback when they can’t convict for the act itself. Those that conspired (presumably before January 6th) to overthrow the government belong in jail. I’m no lawyer, but in order to get a conviction on Trump in relation to these conspirac(ies) I’d have thought a mens rea test would be necessary. Trump merely being a figure a few whackos took inspiration from is hardly proof of intent on Trump’s part. I watched Trump’s speech on the day. As I commented here at the time it was anything but an incitement. In fact I thought it was calm almost to the point of dullness – most un-Trump like.
In legal terms and in reality January 6th was not an attempted insurrection, as evidenced by the failure to even indict anyone under §2383. Perhaps they’ll try and get Trump under §2384 or simply drag out an investigation all the way to 2024 so Hillary can get some ‘payback’.
Barbara Ann,
If Trump’s involvement was merely to serve as a mere muse for those who broke into the Capitol on 6 January, he has nothing to worry about. In the next few weeks, we’ll probably see the entire conspiracy went far beyond that and involved a lot more that a few cosplaying incels. I doubt Congress and the DOJ are going to bury this like they did with the 1933 conspiratorial business plot.
TTG
Understand that you are hoping for conditions of real unrest in this country.
TTG,
FBI lawyer Kevin Clinesmith plead guilty, that means it must not be much of a stretch to prove Clinton was guilty of conspiracy. Obama too.
Fred,
Clinesmith wasn’t even charged with conspiracy. Not even Sussmann was charged with conspiracy. That would be one hell of a stretch.
TTG,
You mean the prosecutors refused to charge conspiracy, kinda like prosecutors in our “mostly peaceful ” cities refusing to charge other criminal conduct.
TTG:
Over a dozen have been charged with 18 US Code § 2384 (seditious conspiracy). Three have already plead guilty. Tying Trump to that seditious conspiracy doesn’t seem like too much of a reach.
PL commented:
Understand that you are hoping for conditions of real unrest in this country.
Thomas Jefferson:
“I hold it that a little rebellion now and then is a good thing, and as necessary in the political world as storms in the physical.”
I do not believe that the USA is stable. Currently (according to estimates from anonymous writers) 15% of Americans believe that Pizzagate is real, i.e., that the political elite of the world engage in serious crimes against children and blackmail networks. Belief in Pizzagate cannot co-exist with the “GloboHomo” agenda. Either the anti-Pizza crusaders will prevail, and GloboHomo will be greatly harmed, or GloboHomo will prevail and belief in Pizzagate will become as illegal as anti-Stalinist sentiment in Stalin’s USSR.
But there are at least fifty million American ‘deplorables’ who will not bend the knee to GloboHomo. That tension is not going to peacefully dissipate, regardless of how many respectable people denounce it from respectable podiums.
Perhaps GloboHomo has enough surveillance nets, enough SWAT troopers, enough Clintonesque lawyers, enough antifa, enough drag queen activists to overwhelm fifty million deplorables. Perhaps not. But the tension cannot be maintained forever. Sooner or later, something has got to break.
And furthermore, in my opinion, Jeffrey Epstein did not kill himself.
Barbara Ann,
The situation in a nutshell, or nut’s hell as I see it;
Forest: An openly psychopathic ex-President.
Trees: Exactly which laws or regulations did lunatics 1,2,3,4,5,…etc violate and can they be held to account?
An openly psychopathic ex-President.
I assume you mean Obama. But maybe you mean Bill Clinton or the Bushes. Or maybe you mean Trump. Sadly, when you say “openly psychopathic ex-President,” many Americans will retort, “Do you have any idea how little that narrows it down?”
Out, damned spot; out, I say. One, two,—why, then ’tis time to do’t. Hell is murky. Fie, my lord, fie, a soldier and afeard? What need we fear who knows it when none can call our power to account? Yet who would have thought the old man to have had so much blood in him?
The old Bard had it spot on did not he. “When none can call our power to account ….”
In this case, the quote applies to Trump’s actions on 6 January. Ultimately, the voters will hold Congress accountable.
It is with total horror we as a nation are even this close to considering this sham accusation – the tyranny of those who decide the definition of words used to imprison us.
Pretty Boy Gavin Newsom is now riding in to the rescue for 2024. On the same talents he used to destroy California – a lifetime connection to Nancy Pelosi and doing the bidding for SEIU and the teachers unions.
Newsom leads this state with #50 ranked K-12 system, and trillions in unfunded public pension debt as his sole accomplishments. Yet billions from Big Tech tax revenues while having the highest poverty rates in America.
The Vichy Republican front woman Liz Cheney sure hopes so.
Looks like Ivanka is already trying to cut a deal too.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10904155/Trump-turns-IVANKA-said-long-checked-election.html
This committee only has legislative powers; not judiciary or DOJ executive branch powers. Not sure what they can do, besides run a star chamber show trial allowing unlimited subpoena harassment of any one they chose to put in their gun sights.
Plus scare the crap out of Americans, when they see what a mono-party super majority can do just like what Democrats have done to California.
Re the possibility you raise:
“The 6 January Committee has IMO already decided to declare Trump to be an insurrectionist
and to refer him to the DoJ with a recommendation for prosecution as such.”
The left likes to criticize right-wing proposals and ideas as being “divisive”.
Jeez, if the left does what you consider,
it is hard to imagine anything more divisive.
After reviewing all evidence , I really believe Trump won.
What the Democrats are doing is disgraceful.
strateshooter,
Would you care to share that evidence? So far all I’ve heard is a lot of empty claims with no evidence.
So far all I’ve heard is a lot of empty claims with no evidence.
I am informed that Dinesh D’Sousa released a whole movie on the topic called 2000 Mules. But I have been hearing evidence about the corruption in the US electoral system for years. I’m not sure where to start. Should I mention Dominion Voting Systems? Should I cite MyPillow CEO Mike Lindell? Should I cite articles from oann.com or justthenews.com? Perhaps I should start with a mainstream news puff piece that claims to debunk claims of conspiracy and patiently explain how it is wrong.
For example:
Fact Check-Does ‘2000 Mules’ provide evidence of voter fraud in the 2020 U.S. presidential election?
A documentary directed by conservative commentator Dinesh D’Souza claims it can prove widespread fraud was carried out during the 2020 presidential election in the United States. Reuters Fact Check examined the main claims presented in the film and did not find any concrete evidence definitively showing proof of fraud.
I could type for hours, arguing that Reuters fact-checkers are wrong and Dinesh D’Sousa is right. I don’t think that would change anyone’s mind, however.
longarch,
I was hoping you’d do better than Lindell and D’Sousa. Those two are in a vigorous competition to see who can be the most batshit crazy in their theories. The ghost of Hugo Chávez in the voting machines is a more plausible theory than what those two are offering.
TTG,
I presume you are skilled in science, engineering, and tech management, and I presume that you have proved to your own satisfaction that election fraud did not happen to any major extent. However, at least fifty million US citizens disagree with that claim.
Within the corridors of power, it may be that 99.9% of the elite believe election fraud did not happen to any major extent. However, if fifty million US citizens — or more — sincerely trust the deplorable demagogues who tell them Trump won but the election was stolen, then it does not matter whether you can prove that election fraud happened or did not happened. The fifty million deplorables will not be swayed by your proof. Perhaps you will be able to defeat the deplorables, but you won’t do it by simply telling them they are batshit crazy.
longarch,
You’re absolutely right. Minds will not be changed. It’s a religious belief, an unshakeable faith.
TTG, You’ve made this site impossible to visit and read comportably. Feels like you’re barking at anyone who doesn’t fall in line with your dogma. This is beyond any sensible debate. Good Bye.
cofer,
If you’re only comfortable with blogs offering only echos of one one side or the other, vaya con Dios. All here, including myself, expect our expressed views to be challenged and are willing to engage in intelligent, and often sharp, debate.
TTG
I hope to have my views challenged, else how am I to learn?
The evidence that Trump won is the barking dog madness of the Democrat party in opposition to him which continues rabidly even today.
Sure, sure, circumstantial evidence only. But there is no other justification for their obsessive TDS and existential need to never let Trump hold office again. Their sheer obsessiveness and casualness with the truth on record is disturbing.
For what crime – that he tried to downsize government, make government accountable, and fired Andrew McCabe, temporarily denying him his pension. That is take no prisoners act of war in the eyes of the Party of the Public Employee Unions. We have seen this same thing play out too many times in California.
WSJ just today defines this pathological and singular obsessiveness of Democrat”progressives”, in contrast to the Olde Tyme Democrat party. Americans know something has gone wrong in the past few years, but few can really put their finger on it. It is national discussion we need to undertake. But one-party take no prisoners obsessiveness is lurking out there as reason number one.
Case in point: terminal TDS. (Trump Derangement Syndrome). What makes this one man so dangerous to Democrat command and control?
Deap Trump, and Trumpism, stands in the way of socialist take over of America. Think I’m wrong? Wait a minute.
We will reach “Banana Republic” status when that happens or the Georgetown Law School fairness.
The Trump restoration will destroy the Deep State, Mainstream Media, The Intellectual Elites, and Big Tech.
It will be Glorious to see…
Sad news on the James Webb Telescope:
https://www.theverge.com/2022/6/8/23160209/nasa-james-webb-space-telescope-meteor-strike-impact
Figured I’d just drop this in here – not that it’ll matter much in “the greater scheme” but I’m thinking where the members of “the investigatory group” are concerned that’s not the point of this latest exercise.
https://nsarchive.gwu.edu/sites/default/files/documents/qxf56q-o0zwb/07.pdf
(The *point I suspect [heh] is to give “just enough coverage” for those pols who’ve laid in to ambush – overwhelmed and fed “us” like mushrooms [keeps us in the dark and feeds us BS] – to keep us in our place.)
The most un-American, most incompetent, most corrupt and by far the most cruelest governing body the US has ever had wants to take out Trump under a leader with a lower approval rating than Trump. I have a feeling this will not go well at all.
“The primetime hearings for the Jan. 6 commission’s investigation into the 2021 Capitol riot were broadcast live on almost every major station, yet failed to capture national interest and produced ratings far below other comparable national televised political events.
Almost 20 million viewers tuned in for the hearings on Thursday night, according to The Hill. By contrast, President Joe Biden’s State of the Union address in March pulled in 38 million viewers. In 2018, then-President Donald Trump’s first State of the Union attracted over 45 million, per the New York Post.”
lemmee guess: less than 20m hardcore D’s had the stomach to even watch this crap?
I have to say I’ve never been a Trump fan, but given how much effort has been put into digging up dirt on him and none has legally stuck, he must be cleaner than I give him credit for.
He has managed to show there are no adults in the room, when it comes to national politics.
After the next couple of years of the Republicans perp walking as many democratic stooges as possible, I can only hope we have some degree of reality check, by 24. Though that may be further down the mountain side than most are willing to contemplate.
Col. Lang,
We live in a shabby banana republic.
– Eliot
Andrew Breibart was always fond of saying politics follow culture.
With the poor ratings Jan 6 show trial, it appears midterm politics will soon be rejecting the Democrat’s shabby attempts rig the culture.
America has tuned out Democrats and Jan 6. It was not an insurrection. It was not sedition and there are no links to Trump on either charge. That is patently ridiculous.
While some may try the ostrich approach with this, they need to contemplate that it will not make reality go away and there is a distinct feature of the posture that comes with it. There will be a lot of testimony, documents and videos shown and it will be rather overwhelming and the defenders of the indefensible, should probably pay close attention to what Liz Chaney had to say about their dishonor.
As it has been said: Facts are pesky things and it appears the committee has found plenty.
Lars
Political persecution of a former president is a certain path to disunion.
Col.,
The DOJ is going after Governor Whitmer’s opponents in the same way, after the state disqualified election nominating petitions of her two leading opponents. Just in time for the news cycle. Meanwhile Ray Epps is still free.
https://www.reuters.com/world/us/michigan-gop-governor-candidate-kelley-arrested-role-capitol-riots-2022-06-09/
It’s also a path to ruining prospects of a fair trial for anyone involved since the Congressional trials are sufficiently public to allow counsels to argue they are prejudicial to prospective jurors.
These hearings aren’t showtrials in the same sense as the trials in the Soviet Union of the 1930s. But they put the Congressional candidates, who are all up for reelection in November, on show. In my opinion that’s what this current nonsensical hot air balooning expedition is really all about. Looking good, virtuous and civically patriotic for the TV and smartphones. I wish they were in fact motivated by a burning desire to the republic. Maybe some are. The side effect of their version of showtrialing is crisis-mongering and crisis nurturing. The country needs baby formula, and not much else. We’re critically over-crisis-ed, it’s better to stop indulging the addiction.
Colonel
In their obsession with harpooning this orange whale I can see two possible motivations for the Ahabs: 1) simple vindictive revenge without a care for what further harm may be done to the Republic, or worse 2) a determination to dare the Deplorables to take action to support their champion – the goal in this case being to reify the imagined domestic terror threat from conservatives. Either way unity is the last thing on their minds.
Barbara Ann,
The corrupt political elites and the majority of the oligarchs all looked pretty unified.
Colonel, that which you placed at, specifically
June 11, 2022 at 8:25 am – on this title concerns me greatly.
“Political persecution of a former president is a certain path to disunion.”
You’ll perhaps catch my drift “admired” being the word. In an older sense :
https://www.etymonline.com/word/admire#etymonline_v_26020
https://gypsyscholarship.blogspot.com/2007/08/finding-myself-lost-in-translation.html
I wonder, nowadays far more than I did when I was younger – at minimum some decade + – than you Sir are yourself that my … oh forebearers I suppose “gifted/imposed” to me to tell the stories.
I’m older now – sooner to go to that ground from whence I emerged from than the other end, that ‘so-called’ beginning.
I retain wonder. I retain joy.
Doesn’t happen much anymore but I still retain ‘a childs capacity’ of awe, which is to say, sometimes, in spite of my reading here : other sites – I’m still capable of ‘appreciation’ (in all those meanings).
Colonel Lang I appreciate I’ve put you “in a fix” offering such as myself any hope for the future of The Republic but if there’s an inspiring sermon to be … available … This is the place to get it, read it.
My observation, personally is that at the point of Trump’s “Victory Over Hillary” – and what followed from that point on was the signal event Mrs. Powell put to Ben Franklin:
https://blogs.loc.gov/manuscripts/2022/01/a-republic-if-you-can-keep-it-elizabeth-willing-powel-benjamin-franklin-and-the-james-mchenry-journal/
The Republic, the scales dropped from my eyes from the moment “Trump won the election over Hillary”
Was lost from that point and forever thereafter.
I’d like to be convinced otherwise.
I’d greatly prefer being convinced otherwise.
The videos already played by this star chamber Jan 6 committee are intentionally edited and truncated for maximum distortion of actual events.
How can that ever win the hearts and minds of anyone, who now has full access to the unedited whole? That is grade school stuff. And speaks only of their own utter contempt for truth and process.
“Find me the man and I will find the crime” –rings in my ears as the sole goal of this sham committee – which denied even the veneer of due process in its very selection of committee members. Anything they present is fruit from a poisonous tree.
“It appears that they have found plenty”. It appears so in the propaganda press. The party organs, CNN, MSNBC, CBS, NYT, W.P. and others all echo the party line of the UnAmerican House Committee. But there has been no discovery, no cross examination, no questions allowed about FIB involvement, and no questions about Pelosis’ decision not to get extra police b/f 1/6. Facts are pesky. Let’s let all the poisons that lurk in the mud hatch out.
Hey Murdoch’s right wing press, WSJ and NY Post are slamming Trump!
“Trump betrayed his supporters…”
“Trump is a captive of his own ego…unfit to be President…”
But Murdoch is letting his Non-readers watch Fox News grovel over Trump!
While Trump was king
His jesters were doing there thing
Pitifully disgusting listening to these so called politicians
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=JeWHviwLMy8
Mcohen
Trump was not “king.” He was a badly miscast NYC businessman.
‘Badly miscast’, but still someone who should be cast again? Since he is, as Walrus puts it below, such a ‘great communicator’?
If the DOJ prosecutes DJT, it will be criminal and it will require facts.
I think Lars, an indictment ‘hanging over his head’ is the only aim at present.
A “House indictment” alone – DoJ in this instance holding (perhaps “threatening”) – but that’ll be about it.
Not being an attorney I can only conjecture that discovery doesn’t apply until there’s a criminal indictment. Yess the House has the power of one of its indictments leading to an impeachment process but in Trump’s instance as he’s not in office nor is he ‘an officer of the Federal government’ he’s beyond the jurisdiction of the House. And besides, the full-blown impeachments process proceeds into the Senate. (Where I’d add – sits a bunch of incumbent Republicans who’d like to keep their seats. Any who dare play along with this charade doing so at their extreme peril.)
I stand to be corrected in my thinking.
The thought occurs.
As the “alleged crime” took place in the district I suppose it’s just possible Mayor Bowser could, possibly, have him charged in “her” jurisdiction, using “her” police and prosecutor.
Now that would be interesting to watch play out!
Lars,
There will be plenty of made up facts like FBI lawyer Clinesmith created for his FISA warrants. Lots of carefully edited video too. Fun times.
Jan 6 committee members read their scripts off teleprompters in this staged event. Does this really qualify as a give and take public hearing, or a long shot for the best fiction writing Oscar?
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2022/06/09/photo-scripted-january-6-committee-hearing-uses-teleprompter/
Scripted NON-Fiction!
But scripted regardless and there’s the rub.
Previously placed before a “neutral” – heh! – polled group the Ds and Progs going 75% Hell Yeah! Rs – if polled at all maybe … [limiting to east coast & Beltway] – 30% Mmm, uhmm, whatever – Independents (Whom we all realize in those GPS Coordinated Townships don’t actually exist) 50/50.
Flyover country – with the exceptions being *vesteds in the retirement plans – 60% totally unaware of there being this Kabuki Theater going on (balloting results mid-term to be *determined at a later date) 2% “closely following” & the remaining percentage primarily wondering “Does the current legal theorizing where Insurrection Law is concerned place me in jeopardy if I teach my Grandkids how to siphon gas from black Suburbans into 5 gallon cans?”
And while the *active duty military vote [historically] has never swung elections ever before there’s always a first time!
I suspect the intention is an indictment to prevent him running. I don’t think they would dare bring him to trial because that would give him a stage and he is a great communicator.
However, the Democrats are idiots.
From an international perspective, I think everyone is trying to work out how to approach dealing with America in the knowledge that the Biden administration is not only corrupt but incompetent, which is the greater danger.
Interesting what Murdoch is doing with his news media. While allowing Fox News to grovel over Trump, Murdock’s right wing oriented WSJ and NY Post opinion writers are slamming Trump:
“Trump betrayed his supporters…”
And,
“Trump is a captive of his own ego…unfit to be President…”
Whether you believe or discard the “fluff” packed into the 1/6 House Select Committee’s presentations, there is at least one crucial FACT:
Trump sat on his fat ass for over 3 hrs and did NOTHING (actually gloating) while our police were attacked/injured and our Capitol ransacked. He failed miserable in his Presidential duties that day, while others (his family, conservative House and Senate members) pleaded that he call the rioters off.
That alone should be enough to cast Trump into history’s garbage pit!
Al, actually, that is not a FACT. Plus you were not there so how could you report he was “gloating”? Nor do we know if he was “sitting for three hours”.
Having a “fat ass” is your only objective assessment. But even that is relative to the average weight we see too many Americans now carry as normal.
Pelosi had already soundly rejected all Trump’s prior offers of help. You need better standards of conduct, before sending anyone to the Gulag if you are using only this ginned up show trial.
Trump is not going anywhere. Get used to it.
Deep,
Rest well your head on the MiPillow for Trumpian dreams.
Something akin to an agenda you have Al?
No need to be so overt buddy. So dadgonned obvious.
‘Round hereabouts there’s plenty o’ opportunities to ‘be i the discrepancies’ – See TTG, Leith, my humble self, Whitewall, &c – No need to get excited “Said the Joker to the King”
https://genius.com/Bob-dylan-all-along-the-watchtower-lyrics
Nah al.trump could not do a thing.this was his Kennedy moment and he kept his mouth shut.remember if trump was shot by a right wing lunatic know one would care.
Rule no.22
Separate the loonies from the bin
The 6 January Committee production may guarantee a Republican President in 2024. If the Committee declares Trump an insurrectionist & refers the finding to DOJ & DOJ then prosecutes Trump & Trump is declared ineligible to be a presidential candidate, this will galvanize the Republican voters. It would eliminate the probability of an intramural fire fight & clear the path for a Republican president in 2024.
TTG, You twisted my words and somehow the ability to reply to you directly was disabled. Shame, what you’ve been doing to the Colonel’s work.
cofer,
Feel free to elaborate, if you wish.
cofer, I have observed that
the ability to directly reply is disabled when
the depth of the replies reaches 5.
I first noticed this when Eric Newhill and I were discussing climate change, and I couldn’t respond to his last point.
And that is the level TTG, and longarch, reached above,
where reply was not offered.
I suspect the reason is a desire to limit the amount of indentation.
Keith Harbaugh and cofer,
True, it’s just a feature of the WordPress software. Nothing sinister. I can respond to comments beyond that limitation on the comment editing/approval page only because Colonel Lang granted me publishing privileges. Cofer, if you want to get something off your chest, go for it.
Just want to make more precise my original comment.
Consider three aspects of the comment
https://turcopolier.com/imo-trump-will-be-indicted-for-leading-an-insurrection-and-barred-from-running-again-until-the-gop-returns-to-power/#comment-205681
1. It is a level 4 comment.
2. It allows (any number of) direct replies. Both TTG and cofer made such replies.
3. None of those comments below it
allow direct replies.
Enough said.