Why Iran, but not Saudi Arabia? – TTG


With the signing of the executive order designed “to protect United States citizens from foreign nationals who intend to commit terrorist acts in the United States,” Trump barred entry into the U.S. of aliens from a list of seven countries for the next ninety days. Notable in this list was the inclusion of Iran and the exclusion of Saudi Arabia. None of the countries are specifically named in the executive order. They are “countries referred to in section 217(a)(12) of the INA, 8 U.S.C. 1187(a)(12).” So rather than naming those countries that he and his national security team think may pose a danger to U.S. citizens, he relies on a list compiled by a Borg infested DOS and DHS of an administration now out of office. So is this a case of SSDD?

This executive order invoked the specter of 9/11, yet Saudi Arabia gets a free pass once again. The country most responsible for supporting and sustaining both the Islamic State and Al Qaeda skates free. The Borg found it convenient to cozy up to the Saudis to further its goals, but why does Trump continue that coziness? He railed against the Clinton Foundation’s Saudi connections. I thought things might change. However, in August of last year, he told Fox News this.

“Saudi Arabia — and I get along great with all of them. They buy apartments from me,” Trump said in Mobile, Alabama. “They spend $40 million, $50 million. Am I supposed to dislike them? I like them very much.”

During his presidential bid, his organization established eight companies tied to hotel interests in Saudi Arabia. Seems the coziness with the fountainhead of radical Islamic terrorism will continue, despite all the bombastic rhetoric, executive decrees and drastic actions taken to supposedly protect U.S. citizens from radical Islamic terrorists. Just more security theater and fodder for the meme machines. Well, it's still early.

Maybe Iran should negotiate with the Trump organization to build a Trump Towers in Teheran and a golf resort in Shiraz. Just think of the marvelous carpets that could decorate the club house. Then, perhaps, they’ll get the same consideration as the Saudis from the current Administration.


Within 24 hours of this executive order, at least two Iraqis who worked with American Forces during our war in Iraq have been denied entry into the United States. One was an interpreter with the 101st for ten years. He and his family have been threatened with death for his loyal service. This situation offends me personally as a retired Army officer. It is an affront to the honor of this country and our Armed Forces. I call on Secretary of Defense Mattis to intervene to right this wrong without haste. I am not naive enough to think this has never happened under Bush and Obama, but they’re not President anymore. I have two words to the Commander in Chief of our Armed Forces if he doesn’t fix this. Disgusting. Sad.


The former translator was released after 17 hours in Federal custody when U.S. Representatives Jerry Nadler and Nydia Valazquez and immigration lawyers went to the Queens airport to intervene on the detained man’s behalf. DOL


This entry was posted in As The Borg Turns, Iran, Saudi Arabia, TTG. Bookmark the permalink.

242 Responses to Why Iran, but not Saudi Arabia? – TTG

  1. David E. Solomon says:

    Colonel Lang,
    I met Donald Trump twice in the Seventies and for what it is worth, now as then, I believe the man to be unhinged.

  2. Origin says:

    The logic of whether Saudi Arabia or not, the anti Muslim, the wall are just part of a concerted effort to create cognitive dissonance. http://www.zeit.de/politik/ausland/2017-01/alternative-facts-donald-trump-sean-spicer-media
    This is about Bannon’s theory of destruction. We have a weird man in the Whitehouse, backed by a new Rasputin. The whole thing is simply un-American an extremely against the moral principles of the nation.

  3. TTG:
    See Robb’s “Will the World be Safer or More Dangerous Under a Trump Presidency?” http://tinyurl.com/jfj6lqd
    “…In Trump’s post cold war world, US foreign policy will be dominated by trade policy. Even national security policy will be subservient to trade policy. If trade policy is dominant, we’ll see China, Mexico and the EU (Germany) become competitors. Russia, in contrast will become an ally since it doesn’t pose a trade threat.”

  4. Jack says:

    TTG, Sir
    As a Trump voter I am bothered that Saudi Arabia and the other nations whose citizens were the 9/11 terrorists were not included in the list for extreme vetting.
    It is clear that Saudi Arabia and the Gulfies are the funding sources for the jihadists and nihilistic Islam that want to export their medieval behavior to the west. They should be the ones that should face sanction the most.

  5. kooshy says:

    Iran just announced will reciprocate the same
    “Iran to ban US citizens in response to Trump’s immigration order

  6. Babak Makkinejad says:

    As far as US and Iran are concerned, this is business as usual – one side screams “Death to America” and the other side bars them from entering US.
    Tit for Tat.
    But in regards to the 9/11/2001 attacks on the United States by Muslim terrorists; Trumps executive order is not any worse, in my opinion, that what Bush II did.
    He went to UAE, a country that was jubilant of 9/11/2001 attacks on US (there were days of celebrations in cities of UAE) and proceeded to harangue Iran from across the Persian Gulf from UAE.
    I asked myself then and I ask myself now: “What price geopolitics?”
    I would like to add that, in my opinion, we witnessing another consequence of the religious war that I have been writing about on this forum, the logical consequence of which, in the fullness of time, would be imprisonment or expulsion of Muslims from the United States.
    Liberalism, in my opinion, cannot endure long under the conditions of religious war.

  7. Hood Canal Gardner says:

    Folks you can put this in the bank: Rex’s fingerprints are on the order someplace.
    As far as domestic terrorists/terrorism suppression goes try ‘our’ drug cartels and the outfits do the laundering. If Trump can ‘sequester/deal for’ El Chapo’s reported 14-15 billion it’d be a waste to pour it into postholes. Better ICE use it to once and for all/get serious ie, chase-down and bust our non-doc”terrorist” employers and their assets right down to the ground/deeper.

  8. kooshy says:

    TTG, IMO this is not about Trump and about terrorism, never was, some of us may forgot just a few months back after the nuclear agreement, US administration of BHO announced that foreign travelers to Iran from a third country must obtain visas to enter US, that was targeting european tourists and businessmen. IMO ever since Iranian revolution nothing has changed and nothing will change between Iran and US. the simple fact is Iran and US in this current US’ geopolitical policy for MENA region are strategic enemies and not compatible. IMO, the JCPOA was just a time limited arms control agreement between Iran and the west, nevertheless, that was the best US could do in lat 38 years. IMO, what US just did and Iran announcement to reciprocate, will elevate Iran’ standing and credibility in the ME region’ and streets level muslims everywhere, especially among resistance.

  9. Babak Makkinejad says:

    They had to do something…
    We have to wait and see how this plays out – with Pakistan and Saudi Arabia.
    The interesting is that Trump’s government has, in effect, sanctioned the historical core of Islamdom.

  10. walrus says:

    In my opinion. this action is going to have unintended consequences from an American point of view.
    From the Trump perspective, this action proves to his base that the President is “Getting things done!”. The plethora of rapid fire executive actions, as Scott Adams points out, will leave his detractors with so many choice targets that they will be so dazed and confused they will not mount effective counter attacks – another “plus” for the President.
    The problem I think I see coming for America is that President Trump is used to an environment ruled by law (no matter how it is enforced) and his world is defined by competitors, suppliers and customers. These folks may get disgruntled from time to time ( so sue me!) but they don’t come after you with ordnance.
    What concerns me is the quality and provenance of advice that President Trump is receiving. A ban on Muslim travel seems to have been an easy “sell” to President Trump, it plays to his base, it makes him look like a man of action it obviously is quite attractive.
    The trouble is that he, in my opinion, may be alienating that small band of muslims that actually like America and what it stands for by this travel ban. To put that another way, 99% or more of those affected are wanting to be in the USA for no other reason then to make a contribution to it. I cannot think of anyone who benefits from this situation except for perhaps the current Israeli Government for whom any American rapprochement with the Islamic world is anathema.

  11. mike says:

    Iran has already reciprocated, and are now barring entry of US citizens. This puts thousands of American jobs at risk if Tehran follows through and cancels their 8-billion dollar deal with Boeing and buys from Airbus instead.
    Trump World Golf Resort in the UAE: where two of the 9/11 attackers came from. And is reportedly building another.
    Trump Towers Istanbul: Turkey is another enabler of Daesh and al-Qaeda terrorism.
    Reportedly there are also deals in Egypt where another of the 9/11 attackers came from. Interesting article in Newsweek regarding Egypt. It tells of Confederate veterans who went there to help Khedive Ismail get out from under the Ottoman yoke. One of those Confederate vets was a Coastal Carolinian, General “Old Blizzards” Loring, who had received two brevets for bravery at Mexico City and lost an arm there.

  12. Babak Makkinejad says:

    Trumps action, both in regards to the Wall against Mexico and the changes to Visa rules affecting 7 Muslim countries are very smart domestic moves by him to assuage as well as cater to his domestic constituency – in my opinion.
    These decisions against foreigners will be and are enormously popular all over the United States; and he could say that he is delivering on his promises.
    Few, I should think, would look carefully at the facts; that there have already been a continuous effort at building a wall or that terrorists hails exclusively from outside of Seljuk boundaries.
    Who would care?
    In my mind, the interesting is that if Trump, in a manner analogous to FDR, would cut Finance Capital to size in the United States. For that one, we have to wait and see.

  13. Babak Makkinejad says:

    In case of Iran, the combined US-EU Economic War against her destroyed the livelihoods of those who actually had been actively trading with EU and other countries and were the cosmopolitan and open-minded men and women of Iran.
    Australia and New Zealand were enthusiastic supporters of that war – by the way.

  14. Babak Makkinejad says:

    Iranians are not stupid; they will not cancel the Boeing order.

  15. Hood Canal Gardner says:

    Should have added that the RICO money/property seized from terrorist employers would be more than enough to dam the Bay/Sacramento River give a good charge to replenishing the Central Valley aquifer the Mexifornia corporations have sucked to the devil’s rooftop.

  16. FourthAndLong says:

    Ruling through fear. Maybe he studied Machiavelli’s ‘The Prince.’

  17. mike says:

    Babak Makkinejad –
    Tehran got a yuuuge discount from Boeing on that deal. Perhaps Airbus cannot match it? So you may be correct.
    I never implied Iranians were stupid.

  18. Nancy K says:

    Trump supporters can spin it anyway they want, but he is giving Saudi’s a pass? He was elected president, not Clinton, I guess that makes him big borg,he might like that title.

  19. Lesly says:

    “Liberalism, in my opinion, cannot endure long under the conditions of religious war.”
    But apparently liberal democracy must accommodate the medieval Salafist cult on behalf of the moneyed class.
    If this man refuses to risk the businesses he presumably divested himself from it is confirmation that when it comes to some aspects of U.S. foreign policy considerations we are still BAU.

  20. mike says:

    Why not bar entry to Tunisians? They provided 6000 headchopping foreign terrorists to Daesh in Syria and Iraq.
    Saudis – 2500; Chechens – 2400; Turks – 2100; Jordanians – 2000.

  21. Babak Makkinejad says:

    Trump just reassured the Gulfies that he is on their side against Iran and the Shia Crescent. This was cost-free & smart move by him to reassure Gulfies.

  22. FB Ali says:

    Nice picture!
    Does it represent the Saudis laughing all the way to the – Trump Tower?

  23. Babak Makkinejad says:

    I think Iranian leaders are arguing something a bit different in their speeches by pointing to the economic war against the nationalist and secular government of Mossadegh as well as the one against the Islamic Republic (within 50 years) and state that the United States and indeed the Western Fortress is against Iranian independence.
    They could be right, when one looks at the analogous situation in Europe where NATO expanded East against the Russian Federation and the subsequent events in Ukraine.
    I suspect and speculate that when Nixon went to China, he might have reassured the Chinese godless brutal human-right-violating dictatorial communist leaders that the United States was not against independent Chinese power.

  24. walrus says:

    Babak, I wouldn’t trust Congress to allow delivery of a single aircraft to Iran. Iran will pay, Boeing will build, but delivery? AIPAC will see that it never happens. As for Airbus, all Congress has to do is prevent American components from being used in an Airbus destined for Iran.

  25. Brunswick says:

    They don’t need to,
    One of Trump’s “election promises”, was to kill the Iran/Boeing deal.

  26. Barish says:

    Regarding the “anti-Muslim” bit one could argue there is certain continuity to what His Excellency Obama oversaw during his tenure:
    “New US visa rules could also cause problems for Americans visiting Europe
    Alan Yuhas in New York
    Thursday 21 January 2016 18.00 GMT
    Controversial anti-terror measure bars dual nationals of Iran, Iraq, Syria or Sudan from visa waiver program and European countries may take reciprocal steps
    The Obama administration has tightened travel terms regarding Iran, Iraq, Syria and Sudan, under rules that will also make travel to the US harder for some Europeans.
    The rules, which took effect on Thursday, create new visa requirements for dual nationals and anyone who has traveled to those countries in the last five years. Many Europeans enjoy visa-free travel to the US. Should they have dual citizenship or have traveled to Iran, Iraq, Syria or Sudan, they will require new permits.
    The new rules, phased in under an anti-terrorism law passed in December, are designed to prevent people radicalized abroad from entering the US.
    Iranian Americans have protested against the law, noting that it may require many of them to obtain visas because of Iran’s rules on citizenship and reciprocity provisions in the law.
    Citizens of 38 countries, including the UK and France, can visit the US for up to 90 days without a visa – unless they are relevant dual nationals. The Department of Homeland Security said it will offer exemptions to the visa rule on a case-by-case basis, and listed potential exceptions for journalists, humanitarian workers, government officials and “legitimate business-related purposes”.
    People who have listed dual nationality with one of the four countries will have their permits revoked, the DHS said. Some people have already been barred from entering the US. […]”
    Similar can be argued for border fences along the US-Mexican border. So yes, plenty of “cognitive dissonance” to be had once one looks past the meme that Mr Trump alone came up with those types of policy.

  27. aleksandar says:

    So Iran will buy russians planes.
    Too much fun to come !

  28. kooshy says:

    Driving on 405 north ( US’ busiest freeway ) I just noticed/spotted a white BMW X5 SUV with Qatar licence plate. So comforting for our security

  29. FB Ali says:

    “Why Iran, but not Saudi Arabia?”
    Anyone seeking a comprehensive answer to that, and associated, questions cannot do better than read (Col/Dr/Prof) Andrew Becevich’s new book, America’s War for the Greater Middle East: A Military History (published in 2016).
    An introduction to the book was given by the author in a talk later that year, which (though about an hour long with the must-not-miss Q & A) is very worthwhile. It’s at: http://tinyurl.com/z8epnq5
    In my view, Andrew Bacevich is the top military historian and analyst in the US today.

  30. AEL says:

    With at least six senior appointees from Goldman Sachs, the chance of Trump taking on Big Finance is very small.

  31. kooshy says:

    Yes indeed that’s my argument as well, not only US can’t and will not accept an foreign policy independent Iran, but also the old europe excepting Italy is having hard time seeing an independent Iran, i don’t see that genie can be put or will go back in bottle. IMO JOCPA was a simple deal, Iran promised not to make a nuke but to continue it’s research, in return, US promise to leave Iran’s trade partners alone. I don’t think US can get any other commitments from Iran in the region.

  32. Thirdeye says:

    Yuge risk for Trump if someone with a KSA or Pakistan connection pulls something like Orlando or San Bernardino on his watch. He would have to own it.

  33. Fred says:

    This is a brilliant move. With one stroke of the pen the President has managed to get all the MSM to acknowledge Saudi Arabia was the birthplace of most of the 9/11 terrorists. They’ll be repeating the rest of what TTG pointed out in a matter of days, if not hours.

  34. Fred says:

    Yeah because Obama or Bush before him followed the legal requirements of that plaque at the base of the Statue of Liberty and allowed such individuals into the country to begin with we’ll just have to impeach Trump after a terrorist attack.

  35. Thirdeye,
    Not only did the majority of the 9/11 attackers come from Saudi Arabia, but the Orlando and San Bernardino shooters traveled to Saudi Arabia before their shooting sprees. Only a self-serving, narcissistic jackass could fail to make the connection.

  36. Fred says:

    So Trump’s no longer Hitler but Czar Nicholas II? I wonder what historical figure he’ll be next week.

  37. D says:

    “The Borg found it convenient to cozy up to the Saudis to further its goals, but why does Trump continue that coziness?”
    Oh, there’s all kinds of coziness going on now . . . “The New Arab–Israeli Alliance”
    “The effect of all this is something no one would have predicted a couple of decades ago and only the most astute predicted even a couple of years ago—the Sunni Arab world, unofficially led by Saudi Arabia, is quietly forging a de facto alliance with Israel against Iran.”

  38. Erich Newhill says:

    Fred, yes. Exactly. Then Trump will ask, “What do you think [People}? Should I add Saudis?” The answer will be a resounding “Yes!” – and so it shall be done. Inshallah.
    People keep under-estimating Trump, to their detriment.

  39. Fred and Erich,
    You could be right. Like I said, it’s still early. However, I don’t understand the foot dragging if that’s the plan. If he named Saudi Arabia yesterday, that would be the center of the coverage today rather than on immigrant hardship stories.

  40. Gordon Wilson says:

    Heckuva job Brownie

    Counseling Trump in the effort will be Stephen K. Bannon, the White House chief strategist whose influence inside the administration is expanding far beyond politics. In a separate presidential memo, Trump reorganized the National Security Council to, along with other changes, give Bannon a regular seat on the principals committee — the meetings of the most senior national security officials, including the secretaries of defense and state.
    That memo also states that the director of national intelligence and the chairman of the Joint Chiefs will sit on the principals committee only when the issues to be discussed pertain to their “responsibilities and expertise.”

    What could possibly go wrong?

  41. Babak Makkinejad says:

    In an ironic way, the Western Fortress operates along analogous lines as the former defunct Communist Block. Orders came out of Moscow with whom Romania, as an example, could trade.
    A few weeks ago, Romanian was finally permitted to resume her decades-long commercial relationship with Iran.
    My guess would be that approval came from Washington DC via Brussels.
    Or how orders came from Moscow that henceforth there would be a wall between Aran, Nakhchevan, Armenia and Georgia on one side and Iran and Turkey on the other side.
    That went on for 70 years until the collapse of USSR.
    The same pattern was re-asserted during the Economic War against Iran by the Western Fortress.
    What difference does it make if Moscow tells you who your friends are or Washington does?

  42. Babak Makkinejad says:

    Iran does not have the money to buy airplane outright. There is complex financing deal in which Iran, in effect, would be renting those airplanes.
    The intermediary will suffer as well.

  43. Babak Makkinejad says:

    Trump and indeed the Western Fortress will no right off their vested interests in the Gulfies.
    Trump has clearly indicated that he sees no upside to denigrating the Gulfies. And I agree that there is no margin for him there; after all, so many in US benefit from their relationship with Gulfies; it pays for private schools for the kids, the House in the Hamptons, the Met season tickets, the Mercedes Benz, the Call Girls, etc.

  44. Erich Newhill says:

    TTG, As you know, Saudis have to be handled more carefully. A lot of Saudi money floating around DC and elsewhere. Trump has to work public opinion in this case.
    And it *is* complicated. Even my humble neighbor/buddy and I have done business more than once with Saudis re; Thoroughbred racing business/Saratoga; which I mention only to demonstrate how prevalent they are. They are awash in money. They’re in a lot of businesses. Agreed that is early and maybe Trump is cucking out on this one. Maybe. We’ll have to wait and see.
    BTW, I agree with you re; the Iraqi interpreter, That sucks.

  45. robt willmann says:

    The “executive order” of 27 January, Protecting the Nation from Foreign Terrorist Entry into the United States, has been hiding out somewhere, and has not appeared with the other executive orders on the White House website, nor have I found it at the Internet site of the Department of Homeland (Internal) Security. The Los Angeles Times newspaper claims to have it, and maybe the White House gave it to the press–
    It has caused finger-pointing at some airports in the U.S. after people with valid visas and green cards (legal permanent resident cards) have been blocked from entering, and has created confusion at airports in foreign countries.
    Section 3(c) of the executive order blocks people, but you have to look at Title 8, U.S. Code, section 1187(a)(12) to find out, and also look where that part points to–
    Section 3(c) of the order also uses the words alien, immigrant, and nonimmigrant. However, they each have a specific meaning in the immigration statute, and that section 3(c) might be a little fast and loose with those words.
    Section 5 of the executive order suspends the U.S. Refugee Admissions Program.
    The executive order as a whole basically dumps it all on retired Gen. John Kelly of DHS, and on Secretary of State Rex Tillerson, who has not yet been confirmed by the senate.
    Today, 28 January, brings more activity. A presidential “memorandum” — as opposed to an executive order — presents a Plan to Defeat the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria, which is actually a plan asking for a preliminary draft of a plan to be done in 30 days–
    Meanwhile, retired Gen. Michael Flynn, Trump’s National Security Advisor, has not been idle. Also presented today is another presidential memorandum, entitled, “Organization of the National Security Council and the Homeland Security Council”–
    I am not familiar with the organizational charts and duties of those “councils”, but the memo might cause a bureaucratic food fight.
    (The website links to the White House press information pages may first display the “splash screen” of the whole website, and you might have to send it a second time, or get past the splash screen and go to the “briefing room” for “presidential actions”.)
    What is the difference between an executive order and a presidential memorandum, to the extent either one or both are even authorized? That would be a fun exercise for another time.

  46. kooshy says:

    I don’t think any Boeing planes will be delivered anytime soon. I am sure Iranian policy makers know this as well, Iran game with US is to show that US can’t be trusted, and will keep it’s promise and will not honor it’s contracts. Iran believes this untrustworthiness will eventually divide the old europe , there are some evidence to that.

  47. Babak Makkinejad says:

    Freedom as understood * practiced West of the Diocletian Line is incompatible with Islam, in my opinion.
    For example, the Call of Mua’azzan, calling the Faithful to God, is privileged speech of God which has no counter part anywhere in the world and abridges Freedom of Expression.
    The same problematic afflicts Judaism – there is no Freedom there either.
    In my view, it will take decades (likely centuries) of intellectual labor to develop theories of Freedom within an Islamic or Judaic milieu that, in some respects, could vaguely approximate that which obtains West of the Diocletian Line.
    Such future theories, however, can never be reconciled to the Salafi, Hanbali, Deobandi and assorted others of that kind. It is an impossibility, in my opinion.

  48. Babak Makkinejad says:

    Nah, Europe will cling to US – they are nothing without US.
    They cannot even comprehend the World without the secret or publicly available US analytical output; how could they even formulate independent policy?

  49. Poul says:

    The new administration may just be copying a list made by the old one.
    “According to the draft copy of Trump’s executive order, the countries whose citizens are barred entirely from entering the United States is based on a bill that Obama signed into law in December 2015.”

  50. raven says:

    But won’t “righting this wrong” bring on the civil war that is so often spoke of here? Isn’t this what Trump voters want?

  51. Gordon Wilson says:

    And then it was no more.here

  52. Poul,
    That’s what I said in the first paragraph. But I find it absurd that an administration that can come up with half a dozen executive orders in a week can’t come up with a simple list of countries supporting terrorism on its own.

  53. raven,
    The wrong I want righted is to stand by those who stood by us in time of war, much like the Hmong and Montagnards decades ago. I would think most Trump voters would want to do the only honorable thing in this case as well. Those who would cavalierly abandon those who risked their lives for us truly are deplorables… despicable scumbags void of all honor.

  54. charly says:

    Boeing and Airbus always give huge discounts. Check the list price of the airplanes they deliver and the turnover Airbus and Boeing have.

  55. charly says:

    A) it keeps Airbus honest and B) makes it much harder to stop Iran from getting spare parts.

  56. Brunswick says:

    Don’t go to 4-chan and other Trump sites like Snafu then.

  57. Jay says:

    I think Larry Johnson has a grip on this..
    Why do I believe that someone in the Borg threw a wrench into this? While this does not surprise me that Judge Donnelly stayed the order.

  58. mike says:

    Well said!

  59. Cold War Zoomie says:

    Looks like we have ~5,000 troops in Iraq. How many other troops do we have operating in Muslim countries? My first impression is that the ham-fisted implementation of this EO is counterproductive to those missions overseas. Those folks with more experience than me might say this isn’t a problem. But why didn’t Trump simply issue an EO with provisions to allow green card holders and those with valid visas entry for a few weeks before shutting it down for 90-120 days for retooling? That seems perfectly legitimate to me.
    I believe Trump does have the right to restrict immigration temporarily while establishing what he thinks is a better vetting process. But I’m not surprised they screwed this up considering their lack of experience. One week in and they already have multiple court cases to contend with.

  60. Jay,
    Larry Johnson simply ignores the absurdity of allowing Saudis free access to the U.S. in spite of their record of being the number one perpetrator of terror attacks against the U.S.

  61. Cold War Zoomie says:

    Larry is right, but that does not excuse this administration for not seeing this lawsuit coming and planning accordingly. I’m not crazy about Trump’s policies, but right now I’m more concerned about his experience and especially the people he has surrounded himself with in the White House. If they deal with China the way they have been forging ahead the last week, it just might be BOHICA time.

  62. Farooq says:

    There is popular support for a Muslim ban so i dont see any logical problems with that decision even if involves interpreters. “Let Allah sort them out” and all.
    However two Christian Syrian families have been deported too. You know the persecuted M.E Christians who were supposed to benefit from the EO.

  63. Sorry this is not on topic but it was so startling to me that I had to see if Col. Lang could comment:

  64. kooshy says:

    In solidarity with banned muslims
    “Madeleine Albright says she is prepared to register as a Muslim under Donald Trump”
    I guess this is the same Madeline of circa 90s in this video who said death of 500000 Iraqi Muslim kids was worth it.
    There is a famous Iranian proverb driven from Obaid Zakani’ famous humorous fable Masnavi Mush-O-Gorbeh (Mouse and Cat)
    مژدگانی که گربه تائب شد
    زاهد و عابد و مسلمانا
    Translation: Reward, the cat has become penitent, pious and a devout Muslims

  65. Gary H says:

    Agree. Also a big Trump supporter. KSA and Gulfies are the biggest terror/jihad supporters.
    But the countries on this list are the very countries the Obama Admin. singled out. Why no outcry then?? https://www.cbp.gov/travel/international-visitors/visa-waiver-program/visa-waiver-program-improvement-and-terrorist-travel-prevention-act-faq

  66. dilbert dogbert,
    Trump can organize his NSC however he deems necessary. He can have a voodoo witch queen and a flock of chickens if he wants. Actually, I’d feel better if that flock of chickens was there rather than Bannon. He reminds me of a grubbier Grima Wormtongue, but with less scruples. You might enjoy this.

  67. Gary H,
    You haven’t been keeping up. I’ve been railing against the Saudis since 9/11 when the Bush team let the Saudis fly out of the country and they suppressed the 28 pages of the 9/11 report. I’ve repeatedly called for someone, anyone to drain the bank accounts of those sons of bitches so they can no longer support the jihadists all over the world.

  68. Abu Sinan says:

    The stay only applies to people currently in custody or in the air. If you are waiting to fly or planning on it you are stuck. It just isn’t refugees or people on tourist visas being banned, it is people with legal residency in the US (green card) as well as dual European nationals too, so if you are a UK citizen and a Yemeni citizen, your British passport will do you no good. I personally know multiple people who are stuck because of this, including one Canadian/Yemeni citizen with a US green card who teaches at Harvard. With the Saudis not include it becomes obvious that this has nothing to do with the security of this nation. Count this as a yuge own goal for Trump.

  69. Bandolero says:

    The deep irony of the German Zeit article complaining about Trump’s petty lies is that it’s author is Marina Weisband, who I remember to have been a leading Kiev-born German-Jewish propagandist peddling serial lies for the Nazi coup in Kiev.
    Regarding Steve Bannon, he just got a seat on the NSC:
    Trump’s Muslim ban has also interesting ramnifications in Germany. As the Spiegel reports the Tehran-born vice chair of the German-American parliamentary group, who also sits on the executive committee of the top notch – very very exclusive – US lobby in Germany, the Atlantikbrücke, is now banned from traveling into the US:
    It seems a bit to me as if Trump is deliberately shutting down the US empire with that move.

  70. Jack says:

    By excluding the Saudis this does not focus on national security but seems more like a PR gimmick. Why do you think the Saudi and Gulfie were not on the list? It would have made sense to include all those countries who have exported terrorists. The guy who shot up all those people in the Turkish night club was from Uzbekistan.
    If the Saudi’s were included for additional vetting it would have sent a powerful signal that the nation that has funded and exported Islamist terrorists will be put on notice.

  71. Jay says:

    TTG, with respects, I’ve known Larry for almost 20 years. Rarely is he off his game. We all agree SA is the cash cow for extremist groups and terrorism. That’s not the issue. Take a look at what he is saying. 7 targeted countries no laws in place. What’s interesting to me was the speed in which opposition responded. It’s almost as if they had advanced warning that this EO was coming down . IMHO this was a set up for failure by Borg hold overs. Donnelly and her activism? Nothing new with her.

  72. Thirdeye says:

    Exactly. And the missus in the San Bernardino case, who radicalized her husband, was from Pakistan.

  73. Cold War Zoomie says:

    Thank you for posting the link to his talk FB Ali. It was excellent. There is so much to unpack from this decades long “arc.” My small part in that arc was maintaining the SIGINT gear used to monitor Operation Earnest Will. Of course I had no idea why we were there. Now I do.

  74. crone says:

    Epic – Is Team Trump Baiting Liberal Media and Refugee Protesters By Using Obama’s Own Policy?…
    Posted on January 28, 2017 by sundance
    Why would the text of President Trump’s Executive Order suspending travel visas be readily available on CNN (HERE), New York Times (HERE), Wall Street Journal (HERE), but not on White House page (HERE)?
    I don’t think it’s accidental. The limiting Visa program was President Obama’s action, not President Trump.
    If you review the actual text of the executive order (copied below in full) what you will immediately notice is the order doesn’t specify ANY countries to be included in the Visa suspension (Iran, Iraq, Libya, Somalia, Sudan, Syria and Yemen).
    President Trump is not suspending visas from countries his team selected, they are simply suspending visa approval from countries President Obama selected. Additionally, Trump is suspending ALL visa applications from those countries – nothing to do with Muslim applications.
    • In 2013 President Obama suspended refugees from Iraq for six months. • In 2015 Congress passed, and Obama signed, a law restricting visas from states of concern; • and in 2016 Obama’s DHS, Jeh Johnson, expanded those restrictions. …. all President Trump is doing is taking the same action as Obama 2013, and applying Visa restrictions to the nation states Obama selected in 2015 and 2016.
    From the Executive order:
    Continue reading → https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2017/01/28/epic-is-team-trump-baiting-liberal-media-and-refugee-protesters-by-using-obamas-own-policy/#more-127798

  75. Old Microbiologist says:

    Exactly, the IL-96 is being ramped up for sales.https://www.rt.com/business/344830-russia-china-joint-plane/

  76. Brunswick says:

    Bannon’s long stated he wanted to destroy the US.

  77. Peter AU says:

    “Within 24 hours of this executive order, at least two Iraqis who worked with American Forces during our war in Iraq have been denied entry into the United States.”
    Hypothetical… at least two Americans who worked with xxxxx forces during the war in
    the USA during our war in the USA have been have been denied entry into xxxx.
    People who work with forces occupying their country are traitors. The SST crew seem to be patriots of their country. I cannot see the likes of TTG, pl, ect working with/for an occupying force.

  78. Peter Reichard says:

    Saudi Arabia is treated with kid gloves because their special relationship with the US is one of the keystones in the arch of America’s global empire allowing us to physically control the world’s oil supply as well as its price through the KSA’s outsized influence in the OPEC price fixing cartel and because they are critical to maintaining the petrodollar scheme which keeps the US dollar preeminent in world finance. Their support of Islamic terrorism is problematic on one hand but is tolerated as it has been paradoxically and cynically used to further US interests when directed against our opponents in such places as Afghanistan, the north Caucasus, Bosnia, western China, Libya and now Syria. Trump is a maverick but still is of the establishment and so is unlikely to tamper with such an important pillar of US hegemony.

  79. LondonBob says:

    As always one can’t rely on the media to give you the facts. Why start with these seven countries? Because the US government already has. In time the policies will be refined, but undoubtedly a step in the right direction.

  80. A ban on Muslims puts U.S. citizens and soldiers abroad at greater risk, prevents development of humint in Muslim countries, & suggests to legal US Muslims that they cannot trust DHS & FBI if they come forward with domestic intel. (I pointed this out over a year ago, when candidate Trump started talking about it.) The idea that “we need to find out what the hell is going on” is the dumbest excuse ever. Security & military people are mostly good and competent, and so we already KNEW what the hell is going on.
    Take a different issue: US trade. Trump is defaulting on U.S. — and Trump (or maybe it’s Bannon calling all the shots) doesn’t even understand this. Pulling out of multilateral trade agreements, threatening a tariff on Mexico to “pay for the wall” etc., will coincidentally let China dominate. It will also lower US standard-of-living, even if it temporarily makes a few more manufacturing jobs — before they disappear again, because manufacturing jobs are disappearing around the whole world.
    How will this happen? Simple trust and economics. For example, countries just spent 6 years negotiating TPP, and now Trump throws it away. He thinks they will go into separate, one-on-one (bilateral) negotiations with him? Too complicated and now nobody trusts the United States. They can all get a better agreement in a coming Chinese trade pact. Fewer headaches, soon to have better technology. The Chinese obviously understand this, look at all their moves over the last few years, they’ve been preparing for it. They intend to hand us Trump’s head on a silver platter.
    Villages in Africa (where Chinese trade officials have been spotted, signing development deals for the village mineral rights) will have faster internet and cable than most places in the U.S., in 5 years. So will Mexico (where Chinese trade officials have also been seen). The Mexicans will finally be paying for that wall, just to keep the norteamericanos out.
    All of this stuff is not only useless, it is counterproductive. I think that Putin didn’t help Trump win because Putin wants a stronger U.S. Putin hates the U.S.! Ex-KGB psych profilers probably suggested that Trump would make more mistakes than Hillary.

  81. Cee says:

    Does she have one foot in grave and another on a banana peel that caused her to express some compassion like Lee Atwater?
    I doubt it. I trust her as far as I could throw the house that landed on her sister with the pointy black shoes.

  82. Cee says:

    Same here. I’ve posted about Springman before
    Well, I wrote the book because more than 20 years of speaking out against what was being done to me and the rest of the world, analyzing the disastrous American foreign policy, the imperial American foreign policy, and not getting a whole lot of response, I said, well, all right. I had done Freedom of Information Act requests with the State Department and got nowhere. I did that in 1992 when I was fired and wanted to find out why, and when State stalled me for two years and gave me no information I filed a lawsuit in US District court. It was sealed and shut down as a threat to national security – and I still wonder why finding out what was going on about my firing was a threat to national security, but I think now we know.

  83. Cee says:

    I want our $$ back from the SOBs who also support them like Bibi.

  84. Cee says:

    I took a few days. This should be brought up again and dealt With.
    Someone was saying they think Trump will throw Israel under the bus in favor of Russia. I wish.

  85. Nancy K says:

    Is Bannon to Grima Wormtongue as Trump is to King Théoden, it is an apt comparison.

  86. Allen Thomson says:

    Any military reactions to Trump’s choice of venue for signing the immigration order?

  87. jonst says:

    The legal principle here is, as far as I grasp it, to put the measures in place where the US govt has determined (correctly or not) that they/we are dealing with a ‘failed’ State, that has therefore lost the capability (admin) to vet people on their end. To exclude Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, et al could be deemed anti Muslim in its impact, in that the admin capablity of those States is still thought to be functioning. However naive that might or might not be. That’s my understanding, anyway. Things are moving very quickly, and chaotically, but with Trump and his opponents in the media. CHarges and counter charges are flying fast and furious, and little law is being read.

  88. Rd says:

    many valid points raised. however, isn’t this a good diversion just days before going to bed with putin? seems like there are those who wish to re-orient US FP from the borg mind set to a kissinger approach. this order will keep every one busy for a good while.

  89. Eric Newhill says:

    TTG – It’s already begun. Watching CNN this morning. The liberals are crying loudly and asking “Why didn’t he include Saudi Arabia. They are he source of the 9/11 attackers and are known to finance a lot of terrorism”. Perfect.

  90. Fred says:

    “Lenin,” he answered, “wanted to destroy the state, and that’s my goal too. I want to bring everything crashing down, and destroy all of today’s establishment.”
    Sounds like “today’s establishment” is in a panic.

  91. Eric Newhill says:

    That makes a lot of sense + the fact that the list of countries was assembled by the Obama admin and was probably perceived as being, therefore, less vulnerable to criticisms.

  92. The Beaver says:

    She needs funding from the GCC for her outfit where quite a few democrats who had served Obama will be looking for jobs .

  93. Cold War Zoomie says:

    “…isn’t this a good diversion just days before going to bed with putin? ”
    Funny that you bring up Putin. I’m wondering how Putin can exploit what looks like a very chaotic situation. Russian open-source analysts must be working overtime right now.

  94. Origin says:

    Perhaps, even Hugo Chavez or Fidel. What he wants is authoritarian power, not a stable nation. The measured decision to include a respected green carded Clemson U. Professor in the ban was bait and provocation. Dividing the polity is a classic authoritarian ploy. These people do not have your interests in their minds. Dividing you and me so you or I can accuse the other of being evil IS their goal. Once they divide US, they can rule, not govern. There is a huge difference between the two methods.

  95. Babak Makkinejad says:

    I do not think it is a diversion.
    Trump has delivered on a promise to his core constituency as well as many who did not necessarily vote for him but thought that Muslims are a dangeorus people to have around inside the United States.
    He outright banned entry into US by the “Usual Suspects” as well as Libya, and Yemen.
    That way appeased both Gulfies and the Israelis as well as the Shoah Cultists (who think there is a margin in War against Islam.)
    At the same time, he also ordered what used to be INS to engage in extreme vetting – that is a bureaucratic way of saying “delay,dray, and deny” – for entry into US by any and all non-citizen Muslims.
    This “extreme vetting” includes Gulfies and Pakistan – but they will grin and bear it.
    I wonder when EU would also impose such a ban?
    Followed by the Russian Federation?

  96. Origin says:

    Thanks for the info about Marina Weisband. Can you post some links about her background for the committee. Interpretation of media is enhanced by knowledge about the authors. Such information will also enhance your credibility so we can know you are not trolling and discrediting an article tale seems logically to ring true.

  97. Lesly says:

    Yes, said this on the FBs:
    When even Dick Cheney, Madeline Albright or John Yoo say something sensible, I still don’t give a f— what they think.
    These people should stay in their holes.

  98. SAC Brat says:

    I was pleased after 9/11 when the US ambassador in Thailand took advantage of the temporary immigration restrictions from the Middle East to take care of former Hmong allies. (The churches I go to have many Hmong members)
    Not sure if Ed Sprague was able to help move more Montagnards. I had read that he had a group that worked hard to help them.

  99. Origin says:

    They wanted to cause the lawsuit. It was their plan. They are playing us all, whether we are left or right. Division is their plan!

  100. SAC Brat says:

    If I remember correctly the British soldiers who served with the Karen in Burma almost staged an uprising when the British government abandoned the Karen after WW II.

  101. robt willmann says:

    Allen Thomson,
    Yes, that signing at the Pentagon and looping in Mattis was not good. Trump does try to manipulate people, and how the behavior of the new administration proceeds is anyone’s guess.
    Mattis did talk on the telephone with Israeli defense minister Avigdor Lieberman (yes, the one who used to be the foreign minister of Israel)–
    “Secretary of Defense Jim Mattis spoke by phone today with Israeli Defense Minister Avigdor Lieberman to underscore his unwavering commitment to Israel’s security. The secretary called his counterpart during his first week to emphasize his intent to advance the U.S.-Israeli defense relationship and to protect Israel’s qualitative military edge.”
    This is always curious because there is no mutual defense treaty between Israel and the U.S., and Israel has never declared its borders, so it is not clear what area is to receive help with “security”.

  102. mike says:

    Seems to be a concerted effort here to blame Obama for making up the list of the seven banned countries. Sorry if this following video busts any bubbles, but that list was started by Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz back in 2003. Darth Cheney and the Likudniks had a hand in it also.
    The 2013 GOP congressional action banning those countries followed 10 years later. Yes, Obama signed it, but don’t forget that it was part of a larger much-needed package.

  103. robt willmann says:

    One of the countries covered by the executive order, Yemen, was the scene of a commando raid, apparently approved by Trump, that resulted in the death of one U.S. soldier, and injuries when the “Osprey” aircraft malfunctioned. From the article, it seems that the person killed was in a Navy Seal unit (web browser cookies are needed to view it)–

  104. Origin – Below us on this thread there’s a whole heap of valuable stuff on an issue of some importance. Most of it’s foreign to me – literally – but there’s enough linkage to how the same issue affects us in England for me to be able to follow it.
    Then I return, puzzled, to this point in the thread. I’m sorry, but I don’t find myself able to follow it.
    Let’s take what I think may be the main statement: there’s a concerted effort to create cognitive dissonance. Fair enough. Cognitive dissonance doesn’t sound very good for us and I can see that it won’t do at all if someone is making a concerted effort to create it. Mrs Clinton went in for that more than was agreeable in your recent elections and, like you, I think it would be unfortunate if we saw more of the same from the current American administration. So I follow the link to Die Zeit to see what it’s all about.
    I come away no wiser. What’s the man saying? Take one bit at random –
    “The new right-wing governments and parties are currently forcing democratic societies to fight again for values we had already won. To lose this battle would be simply disastrous.”
    What are these “values we had already won”? Where do we see them in action? In the Ukraine? In Syria? In Greece? In the Beltway? In the handling of the American economy? Obviously not. In our own experience? I don’t know about you, but in comparison with only a few decades ago public moral values have gone even further downhill – the politicians scarcely bother to even pretend any more – and as for private moral values, well, they’re still as solid as ever for most, but woe betide if you step an inch away from any expression of those moral values that doesn’t fit into the current PC straitjacket.
    But the writer of the piece you’ve linked to rides over all that. He’s not interested in telling us what these moral values are and where we can see them working. He’s merely reciting a few formulae that serve to fill out the space. He could as well have said “I don’t like Trump” and left it at that. The rest is meaningless as far as connected argument goes. It reminds me of the “Hope and Change” era. A truly great line, until you asked what we were hoping for and where we were changing. We never found out, in your country or here, and those eight years of disillusion have left us soured with empty rhetoric.
    The Die Zeit article gives us a useful insight into how far away the European political establishment is from coming to terms with that equivalent disillusion here . It tells us too that the predators in Festung Europa are still attempting to cloak their predation with an appeal to moral values they themselves do not exemplify. As an argument in its own right, however, it is valueless. It means nothing but pretends to mean a lot. We’ve had enough of that from the politicians, surely?

  105. mike says:

    Pope Francis: “It’s hypocrisy to call yourself a Christian and chase away a refugee or someone seeking help, someone who is hungry or thirsty, toss out someone who is in need of my help,…”

  106. Degringolade says:

    Sort of on-topic: A quote from an article in Politico
    Tillerson will need to install invaluable deputies—including new senior officials for Russia and the Middle East. The occupants of those two jobs, Victoria Nuland and Anne Patterson, resigned this month, taking a trove of institutional knowledge with them.
    Well Y’all, I for one am ecstatic that that particular flavor of “Institutional Knowledge” is off the table.

  107. Jay,
    I get Larry Johnson’s point that the U.S. is not obliged to allow anyone into the country. He’s also right that this shouldn’t be framed as a ban on Muslims. We are continuing to kiss up to the Gulfies. The stated purpose of the ban is to protect Americans from radical Islamic terrorism yet we allow travel from the demonstrated religious, philosophical, organizational and financial source of that radical Islamic terrorism. This morning Priebus explained that something like a three day warning of the implementation of this ban would have alerted the terrorists to get here before the ban was put in place. Well, by applying this ban against a half-assed list of countries compiled by Borg and Likudnik friendly former administrations completely negated that plan. Priebus is full of crap.
    I’m not at all surprised about the immediate and dramatic uprising against how this ban was implemented. It was implemented in the most egregious way possible targeting returning green card holding family members, children trying to return to their families and refugees who demonstrated their love of our country by putting their lives on the line supporting our troops in battle. If a three to seven day warning was given, those examples would have been eliminated. The mostly spontaneous large gatherings at international airports was made easier by the short distances involved and social media. I find it hard to believe the Whitehouse didn’t foresee this all happening. I think they enjoyed the spectacle. They energized the “make America white again” portion of their base and also energized their leftist “no borders” opposition. Maybe it wasn’t an accident that Trump quoted Bane in this inauguration speech.

  108. Babak Makkinejad says:

    I think this entire development is anathema to the ideas and ideals of Enlightenment upon which the United States and Western European culture and civilization rests.
    In effect, Trump, with this executive order, has taken them back to the days before Voltaire – when religion and religious identity was a very explicit and grand part of European Culture and Politics.
    Trump’s actions, however, were preceded by actions of others that also went against the Western Liberal tradition. Consider the ban on the so-called “Burkini” by the French government.
    Around 1900, European women bathed in something not too dissimilar to the Burkini on public beaches. The ban, in my opinion, was both ridiculous as well as went against the principle of religious toleration and the right to dress as one likes as long as one is not lewd/ obscene — quite the opposite!
    Lastly, the United States and the European states are now in the untenable position – in my opinion – of having to adjudicate among religions of the world and their conflicting claims at the politico-religious level; sects of Islam, sects of Judaism, and sects of Christianity.
    It is almost like the Hegelian thesis, anti-thesis, Synthesis model of historical development; the anti-religion Enlightenment Consciousness resulting in Religious Awakening.

  109. Degringolade,
    I’m definitely with you on this one. Being rid of Nuland and her institutional knowledge is like finding out you’re suddenly cancer free.

  110. Tyler says:

    Nothing says “stable nation” like a polyglot assortment of cultures and languages.

  111. Tyler says:

    Nah. You’ll find something else to beat your breast about regading Trump.
    As others have mentioned, this list came from the Obama Admin. Trump did in one day more to expose the fact that Saudi Arabia is terrorist sponsor than the last 16 years of MSM reporting.
    But he gets no credit because he’s “vulgar” and not Bernie. Oh well.

  112. Tyler says:

    Oh, are we doing the thing where we selectively quote the Pope while ignoring what he says about stuff like abortion?
    How many refugees are in Vatican City?

  113. Laura says:

    Jack, perhaps you should have read more of Trump’s foreign policy and national security statements before voting and should have compared the two candidates on each issue. Oh, and perhaps considered their relative experience in each area.
    You are correct…it is clear to those who care.
    Heck, Trump probably “believes” (I will not use thinks for this man) that the 9/11 terrorists were Iraqis!
    Who knows? Really, who knows.

  114. mike says:

    Ty –
    The list came from Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz back in 03.

  115. Cvillereader says:

    Pope Francis is not one who should be talking about hypocrisy these days. His concept of mercy is highly selective, particularly as it applies to orthodox Catholics that don’t care for the messes he seems so fond of making.

  116. Origin says:

    I disagree that this is Obama’s policy repackaged. The order was skillfully written to cause chaos. We have a sharply divided nation. One side is innately fearful of immigrants. Another group believes strongly that fairly open immigration is at the heart of America’s genius. Some in the fearful group have a very inflexible, black and white view of laws. There is a virulent dedication to due process and a complicated understanding of the evolutionary nature of jurisprudence.
    The agencies recommended the honoring of existing visas and green cards. The reality is that via holders and visa holders HAVE been thoroughly vetted and are not terrorists. But, knowing the consequences of including the green card people and the military translator refugees into the order, a conscious decision was made to bait the left, the believers in due process into action. The purpose was to make a large part of the citizenry the enemy of the right. The purpose was to divide. It worked brilliantly! Trump is at war, not only with the press, but also with very people of the United States. We are all being played so that Trump and Bannon can rule us, not govern us by our consent.

  117. Origin says:

    I guess the military, packed with West Pointers who were inculcated with the Honor Code are dangerous to the Trump administration. Such men will not engage in an authoritarian information operation against the citizenry.

  118. Babak Makkinejad says:

    Why do you support Lawlessness?

  119. Annem says:

    You have all identified the contradiction in which countries were put on the list and which were not and the unspoken rationale for which were excluded from the ban.
    They also chose to ignore the procedures already in place for refugees. It is hard to see how much more “extreme” the already 18-24 month vetting process could be made. It includes all the biometric and other ID measures now being introduced in addition to thorough background checks and multiple interviews.
    Just recently, the state department office that handles refugees testified before congress and was asked about why only 1% of the Syrians admitted under this program were Christians. She answered that most of them are not refugees, but live in government-controlled parts of the country [think West Aleppo] and that those who gravitated towards Lebanon face the problem of the small size of the UNHCR staff there that are the first party to screen refugees and provide their names to the refugee-admitting countries.
    It is also worth noting that among the 12K refugees admitted so far from Syria, they are mostly families, with only 1% single men.
    What has been done to our Iraqi and Afghan translators and others who worked with our troops and Embassies, this is a national scandal and this should be the time to draw the new administration’s attention to it. Many have been killed waiting for admission.
    Meanwhile, all of this, including comments about Islam and even worse, the notion that we could “take their oil” put our troops in the field at serious risk. As it is, many in the Iraqi army and most certainly the Shia militias don’t want us there as it is.
    I think that Gen. Mattis, and Mr. Tillerson and Pompeo need to weigh in immediately, first taking the time to be briefed by the career professionals who work this issue. This is a matter of force protection, the safety of US troops and other Americans living and working in the Middle East.
    All of this and other pronouncements make me wonder what, if anything, our public diplomacy officers in the field can possibly say or do with regard to things that are in direct contradiction to what we have always said were our “values.”

  120. Bandolero says:

    Regarding Ukraine, I remember her well being very active on Twitter, and in German mass media, too. Her Twitter ist @Afelia. If you speak German, just search for her in Google for 1.1.2014 to 21.2.2014:
    You find stuff like this:
    Right wing militia protecting protest camps:
    And see here, her call for EU support for the coup:
    And here how happy jews in Ukraine are with the putsch:
    She was one of Germany’s leading voices for the putsch, and especially credible for many young people, as she was prominent in the Pirate party, which was popular with youths here.

  121. Tyler,
    Yes, I most assuredly will find something else to rail against regarding Trump. Get used to it. Right now I find it amusing to watch those defending Trump with cries of “but, but, but it was Obama’s list.” Trump certainly wasn’t powerless to change that list in his EO. Is Trump under Borg control? Did Obama force him into this with a Jedi mind trick like some black Obi-Wan Kenobi? Trump had no problem adding and then omitting his call for establishing safe zones in that same EO.
    Obama’s release of the 28 pages of the 9/11 report didn’t move the U.S. public or its politicians to rise up against the Saudis. I don’t have a lot of faith that Trump’s immigration free pass to the Saudis will do it either. The one saving grace is that Bush and Obama sucked up to the Gulfies for a total of sixteen years. Trump has only done so for one week. He, and he alone, could change that in another week or a month.

  122. Origin says:

    And there goes the”Rule of Law” , the lack of which you have so often complained about in so many posts. The country depends on the executive respect for judicial rulings. You want chaos like Bannon.

  123. Tyler says:

    Trump has shown he is canny in ways you refuse to give him credit for. He let the media defang ITSELF by pointing this out. How many clips do we have now of the MSM saying that the 9/11 hijackers were Saudi?
    Pointing out its Obama’s list to those running to the fainting couches is totally valid by showing what hypocrisy looks like. If you don’t like it, oh well.

  124. Fred says:

    A green card holder is a guest in the USA. It is not a sacrosanct status. The Executive Branch of government decides whether to continue that status.
    “These people” – the nameless foe! “Dividing the polity is a classic authoritarian ploy” – like founders of Black Lives Matter? Oh, wait, that would be a non-sequitor, rather than a simple method of pointing out that “those people” do not have interests identical to mine and that the politicians they want to elect might enact policies detrimental to my interests – as determined by me and not some politician or, secularism forbid, some professor? That organization and its backers are not divisive, no not at all. It is the “other” “these people” that are divisive. However, look on the bright side. If President Donald J. Trump revokes all the visas and greed cards of foreign national professors, respected or not, there will be lots of job opportunities for unemployed academics who are American citizens.

  125. Tyler says:

    Origin, Babak,
    “Rule of law” is NOT an unelected mandarin massaging the law to give herself superpowers to thwart the people’s will. You do not spell judge K I N G. Put your faces in it. Get a good whiff of it.
    Why do a billion Muslims insist that they have a right to come to the United States? Why are these people demanding to be ruled by Literally Hitler?

  126. Tyler says:

    You and Pope Frank should read your Bible more.
    It is not right to take the children’s bread and toss it to the dogs.
    – Matthew 15:26

  127. Jack says:

    I did precisely that, compare the two candidates and there was no way I could have supported the proven warmonger Borg Queen who had a track record of supporting every war and intervention in the past decades.
    As I noted here, I will be very happy if all Trump accomplished was a rapprochement with Russia.
    Now, that does not mean I can’t or won’t criticize his policies. I think he should have gone further and added Saudi Arabia and the Gulfies to the extreme vetting list. He may yet do that.
    BTW, I am very pleased that he fired a lot of borgists from the State Department. A very good start. And all in just the first week in office. Note that I have no regret in voting for Trump.

  128. Tyler says:

    Just an FYI for all you people currently in the process of losing your minds:
    People with Non immigrant visas are getting kicked back. LAPRs are getting extended interviews.
    No where does a visa guarantee entry. Lrn2ImmLaw

  129. Jack says:

    Your point is very plausible. However, as we have seen the MSM were going to make it all about a Muslim ban. So, IMO, it would have made the firestorm even bigger if Saudi Arabia and the Gulfies were on the list and shown so clearly that the Borg and their media are really supporters of radical Islamic terrorists.

  130. Jack says:

    “The reality is that via holders and visa holders HAVE been thoroughly vetted and are not terrorists.”
    Origin, you should tell that to the families of the innocent victims of the San Bernardino terrorist killing. How thorough was the vetting of the wife accomplice from Pakistan who lived in Saudi Arabia?

  131. Tel says:

    Totally agree, this is a disappointing Trump decision, probably intended mostly as a show of being tough on terror without addressing the real issue.

  132. different clue says:

    This all points up again and reveals the deepness of the absolute immorality of the Democratic Party in offering us a loathsome thing like Hillary Clinton and demanding that we vote for it.
    Trump gets worser faster than I ever imagined, and yet I would still vote for Trump against Clinton.
    As to TTG’s point, I too was struck by the Trump Order keeping one of our faithful Iraqi allies and supporters under detention. Clearly Trump has zero honor, and zero concept of what honor even is.

  133. Cee,
    Tru dat! Trump is in a position to do just that if he chooses to. It’s a bad investment and a deal that should definitely be renegotiated.

  134. “Such men will not engage in an authoritarian information operation against the citizenry.”
    No worries. We have the CIA for that.

  135. different clue says:

    Lee A. Arnold,
    No countries ever negotiated TPP. Corporate-front government negotiators negotiated it, and they negotiated it in secret in a determined effort to prevent their citizens from ever learning what was in it. It was a Corporate OverClass conspiracy against the citizens and subjects of all these countries.
    Part of why I voted for Trump was my hope that Trump would indeed throw away the International Free Trade Conspiracy’s so-called “TPP”.
    So I have achieved one of my Three Big Things. If the other 11 governments involved think TPP is such a great thing, let them put their ll countries under Transnational Corporate Globalonial Plantationist rule.

  136. mike says:

    Jack –
    Pakistan! Saudi Arabia! Exactly. Thanks for making TTG’s point.

  137. Exactly! I now have Democrat friends (and relatives!) on Facebook circulating memes praising Cheney. Sickening and pathetic …

  138. The Obama-era State Dept. was definitely one swamp in need of draining. Will the CIA be next?

  139. different clue says:

    Babak Makkinejad,
    Bunches of Jewish religious thinkers have been working on that reconciliation of Diocletian-zone Freedom and Revealed Religion you speak of. Reform Judaism, Conservative Judaism, Reconstructionist Judaism, etc. Where it will go remains to be seen, but the effort is being made.

  140. different clue says:

    Babak Makkinejad,
    Europe could if Europe wanted to. They are rich enough and populated enough to do all that. They could leave NATO and form their own NEATO ( North East Atlantic Treaty Organization) if they wanted to. So why don’t they want to?

  141. different clue says:

    This might indeed be the hook upon which the Party Republicans and Party Democrats would hope to hang an impeachment of Trump upon.
    One would hope that Trump’s supporters in various Republican represented Districts could prevent their Reps from voting for any such Articles of Impeachment.

  142. different clue says:

    That . . . is an interesting theory. And since Babak Makkinejad has offered an exactly-opposite counter-theory, we have just seen a narrowly tailored political science experiment set into motion.

  143. different clue says:

    Either Fred is correct or Babak Makkinejad is correct in their analysis-based prediction of whether KSA will or won’t be added to the denial-of-entry list. The neat thing here is that we won’t have to endlessly speculate and take sides for one theory or the other in theory. We will actually receive an answer. KSA either will or won’t be added to the list. One theory or the other will be proven correct.

  144. Babak Makkinejad says:

    You are, if memory serves, an Officer of the Law.
    It behooves you then to support the Law; it might be a terrible Law, but it is the Law nevertheless.
    As for your questions in your last paragraph, you need to address “them Muzlimz”.

  145. turcopolier says:

    The USMA honor code has to do with Lying, Cheating and Stealing. Nothing else. pl

  146. Tyler says:

    Seriously, explain to me how Trump is outside 8 USC 1182 and the judge isn’t massaging law to rule how she wants to cause Rule of Feelz.

  147. Brunswick says:

    “As the night wore on, it became increasingly clear that CBP was defying Brinkema’s ruling. Lawyers concluded that that meant someone was in contempt of court. The judge could theoretically send in federal law enforcement officers to force CBP to let the lawyers meet with the detainees. But sending in the U.S. Marshals—who are part of the Department of Justice—to take on Customs and Border Patrol—which is part of the Department of Homeland Security—would have been a bureaucratic clash of the titans. And, like everything else that night, it would have been unprecedented. It didn’t happen. ”
    Oh well, it was a nice Democracy when you had it.

  148. Babak Makkinejad says:

    I merely offered a hypothesis – and not a theory.
    There was also this:
    “British navy to lead Gulf ‘war games’ amid Iran tensions”
    So, UK is committed to defending Gulfies against Iran; Teresa May stated as much in her meeting with Trump.
    I do not see any alteration in the relationship between the United States and the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia.
    It has withstood the test of time over a 90-year period (WWII, De-colonization, Arab Nationalism, Iranian Revolution, Afghans Wars, Iraq Wars, 9/11 attacks) and I see no end to it or any revision.
    Furthermore, petro-dollar recycling is not ending either; with more than half of Sovereign Funds of Gulfies being invested in US alone.
    Gulfies will swallow this humiliation and move on; it is not like they have any choices besides US.

  149. Babak Makkinejad says:

    I do not know the reasoning behind the decisions of the European leaders and electorates. There are many on this forum – lurking or not – that are Europeans and can shed light on their countries’ choices.
    It must be – I speculate – that they like all things American and wish to be on US side.
    As for your idea of NEATO; that would mean that the Europeans must unify – both politically and militarily – under Germany. I do not believe they are prepared for that. And then there is the Russian Federation which would almost certainly start moving West – by hook or crook – to counter the New Reich.
    It would be truly a repeat of history when Goths overran the frontiers of the Roman Empire; we would likely see new Germanic Kingdoms in North Africa as well – just like the Barbaric Kingdoms of yore.
    But, really, one ought to ask Europeans what they think on this subject.

  150. kooshy says:

    That’s nothing, here in our beautiful Malibu, before and after it seceded for LA ( incorporate to a city), all male and female surfer wear Burkinis, some time is called wetsuit. Actualy without, one would be in deep shit.

  151. Origin says:

    Shouldn’t Saudi Arabia be at the very top of the extreme vetting list followed by Pakistan. Neither is. The absence calls the rationale for the lust into question. The thing is simply theatrics playing us all

  152. Paul Mooney says:

    FB Ali:
    Thanks for posting the link. I took the hour to watch the talk and I found it interesting. I think I will go ahead and maybe buy the book. Hey wait – do you work for the publisher? 😉
    For me one of the interesting things discussed was “why are we there?” – given the US reliance on the region of energy has all but vanished. We seem to be on kind of auto-pilot. I’m not sure I buy into his explanation that we are there to show everyone, ourselves included, that we “are a people to whom limits do not apply” or to reaffirm that the “American Century” was going to continue into the 21st. It is an interesting argument.
    It was definitely worth the hour for sure!

  153. Fred says:

    I’m not in the Davos crowd. Just what are my vested interests in the Gulfies? The total actual population of subjects is smaller than Delaware’s. Some rich folks are going to get a tax write off? Boo hoo. The only people to have compassion for are the expatriated professionals employed by the Gulf states and even more so the poor bastards doing all the dirty jobs there. Removing the top veneer in any of those places will not eliminate the need for a government nor the human infrastructural support that goes along with it. A couple of those states posses oil and the others posses tax shelters. I don’t see any of that changing because of a change in government. Maybe the Gulfies should reform before somebody decides to reform them. On second thought maybe we should be looking into whether they are part and parcel of a “color revolution” brewing here in the US.

  154. Doesn’t matter whether “countries” stands for “corporate-front government negotiators” or not!
    If all the other countries join a “Transnational Corporate Globalonial Plantationist” trade pact and the U.S. is shut out, then there might be a little economic boost in the U.S. until the wealthiest get their tax cuts.
    After that, they will get that money OUT of the United States, to invest it in one of the countries under the “Global Corporate Globalonial Plantationist” rule, where it will get a much higher global ROI, than investing in your U.S. job at Wal-Mart.

  155. different clue says:

    Babak Makkinejad,
    You are correct, and thank you for noting the difference between a hypothesis and a theory. I have been out of high school and college for enough decades now that I sometimes forget the difference between a scientific hypothesis and a scientific theory.
    So . . . you and Fred have offered us opposite predictions of what Trump will do regarding KSA and the List. Since this is politics and not esactly science, I don’t know whether the reasoning behind these predictions should be called strictly a hypothesis or a theory. I offer to split the difference and call them a hypotheory . . . or a theorypothesis, if you prefer.
    Either way, we have seen something very close to a tightly constructed experiment set into motion.

  156. different clue says:

    Seamus Padraig,
    And the Clintocratic Party. And the Clintocratic MSM-Borg fake news Media. Don’t lets forget them.

  157. Origin says:

    A billion Muslims aren’t claiming a right to immigrate.

  158. Jack says:

    The MSM were always gonna make this into a Muslim ban and hyperventilate. The SJWs were always gonna protest. Not that they mustered many folks even in NYC.
    IMO, the Trump administration didn’t go far enough. They should have included every country that exported jihadists. They should not have put a time limit on the enhanced vetting. They should have also instituted re-vetting of those already here from those countries. They should make the vetting guidelines tough and extensive. The Islamic nihilists should be systematically identified, removed and prevented from entry into the USA.
    Of course this can be done by following the law and due process. Considering the San Bernardino, Chattanooga, Orlando cases it is not only potential entrants but those already here as citizens that should be investigated for allegiance to jihad. We’ve gone after the mob hard. Why shouldn’t we go after the jihadists harder?

  159. Tyler says:

    1) Not when the judge’s rule isn’t “law” but muh feelz
    2) Snark means you don’t have an answer.
    3) Explain to me how President Trump is unlawful with 8 USC 1182. Or are you now wearing the mantle of US Imm Law Expert??

  160. different clue says:

    The Twisted Genius,
    I never saw that Batman movie so while I “know who Bane is” I don’t know what that quote is. Could you or someone else offer the Trump-words which are a quote of Bane from the Batman movie?

  161. Origin says:

    How can these honorable soldiers tolerate Trump’s lies and follow them to implement military orders based upon them? Is not the acceptance of foreign emoluments by a President stealing? Is not the withholding of his tax returns a form of cheating to mask conflicts of interest a manner of cheating?

  162. Jack says:

    Yes, Saudi Arabia and Pakistan should be on the top of the list. 9/11 was planned and orchestrated in Pakistan and used many Saudis to execute. But, not having them on the list right away does not mean just theatrics as even a half measure is better than none.
    And your earlier point that vetting is good has been proven incorrect by the San Bernardino example. Clearly the vetting needs to get much more stringent even if that means some deserving immigrants are denied.

  163. Tyler says:

    The idea that it is “unconstitutional” to deny Muslims entry to the US is indeed, insisting they have the right to come here.

  164. Tyler says:

    Massage that law baby. Lay on that judicial gloss with a trowel. Permutations and penumbras everywhere.
    The reason the USM doesn’t do it is because CBP isn’t going out side the relevant statute (8 USC 1182) and they don’t want to get slapped with 8 USC 111.

  165. turcopolier says:

    You are a very naïve man and becoming more so. You mistake them for Boy Scouts. They obey the letter of the law. He would have to give them a patently illegal order such as arrest the Congress or he would have to be impeached and convicted. They don’t care about the moral and ethical sensitivities of civilians. pl

  166. FourthAndLong says:

    Yes. Like trying to herd cats.

  167. FourthAndLong says:

    I’ve heard that Trump refers to the EU in private as ‘the consortium’, and that he has a bone to pick with the EU because of their past ‘meddling’ which caused a business deal of his to fail.
    So looking for deep strategy in any of these past weeks’ goings on may be misplaced. He is easily able to change the course of history over a trifle: petty vindictive instinct.
    Just my opinion.

  168. walrus says:

    From what I’ve read of Bannons background, I think we are going to have to fasten our seat belts. My guess is that we are going to see a raft of measures put through as executive orders so fast that the punditry and perhaps the Borg are not going to be able to keep up. That is the desired state – chaos – keeping “the enemy” perpetually off balance.
    This blunt instrument approach acknowledges that there is going to be “collateral damage” to people and institutions – victims of circumstances. It is I think justified in the Trump Administrations perceived need to hit the ground running, get goals on the scoreboard with their base, confound opposition by their speed…..and hopefully spend the remainder of the Trump Presidency cleaning up the mess left after their radical restructuring.
    This what the Australian Whitlam Government termed a “crash through or crash” strategy.
    Expect more of the same.
    What I don’t know about is the psychological make up of Trump and his advisors, which will tell us more about the directions they may take.

  169. Cee says:

    Lee A.
    The Chinese have gone in with butter. The US has gone into Africa with bombs and turning a blind eye to crazed groups like Boko Haram

  170. Cee says:

    Thank you. He’s never been invited to speak anywhere in the MSM and when I see the same liars over and over I want to smash the TV. Disgraceful!!

  171. FourthAndLong says:

    If I had to guess, I would think that given the rather long history of US & Saudi involvement in all manner of “black operations” etc, odds are close to certain that the US government does not push the obviously egregious issue you point to for the simple reason that the Saudis have equally egregious dirt on the US. Essentially they have long ago taken out insurance on things.
    But I take no pleasure in such comforting. Had I been King retribution for the 911 attack might have been something on the order of Genghis Khan on a bad day.

  172. Prem says:

    Why Iran, Yemen, Syria etc and not Saudi Arabia, Pakistan etc? Well, the former have few friends in DC. Maybe Trump is hoping that the threat of extending the ban will improve the behaviour of the latter.
    As often happens with Trump, there is the kernel of a good idea, but it is lost in the ham-fisted, unsubtle, very stupid way it has been expressed and implemented.
    The real issue is this: currently the USA is ~1% Muslim. If that number rises to our western European levels, ~5-10%, that will be a *very* consequential change.
    American society as you know it will not be recognisable in many ways. You will need very hands-on, intrusive policing. The 2nd Amendment in its current form won’t survive. And neither, perhaps, the 1st Amendment.
    I think it is legitimate for Americans to give this a pass. But it needs to be done by changing the asylum and immigration system in a nuanced way that doesn’t target individuals, or Muslims as a group.
    You need to adopt a Canadian or Australian style points system, that restricts immigration to the highly skilled. And you need to limit family reunion visas, and maybe discourage marriage to cousins from “back home”.
    Of course, this will involve doing some illiberal things, but they needn’t be as noisy and egregious as the current approach.

  173. Tyler says:

    Not an answer. How is President Trump guilty of anything other that crushing your feelings by utilizing 8 USC 1182. Ill wait.

  174. Tyler says:

    Its coming.
    Now, how many people who were in full throated bellows regarding SA and Pakistan are going to change their position once those two countries are added to the list????

  175. Cold War Zoomie says:

    Keeping an eye on this…
    “Iraqi lawmakers said Sunday that they might ban U.S. nationals from entering the country in retaliation against U.S. President Donald Trump’s executive order on Iraqis in the U.S., a move that could hinder the fight against ISIS.”
    Might be bluster. Might not. I don’t know.

  176. mike says:

    Cold War Zoomie –
    That was a committee, not the full parliment. And the PM, Abadi, has said NO, that Iraq would not sink that low.
    But because of Trump’s ban, there are lots of threats to US troops in Iraq from Muqtada al Sadr and from Hashd al Shaabi.

  177. I’m glad the two Iraqis had their case reviewed. I don’t know if you’ve seen these two recent tweets from President Trump:-
    “The joint statement of former presidential candidates John McCain & Lindsey Graham is wrong – they are sadly weak on immigration. The two…
    Senators should focus their energies on ISIS, illegal immigration and border security instead of always looking to start World War III.”
    9:45 PM – 29 Jan 2017
    Fighting talk. I can almost hear George Galloway – he’s one of the few fighting politicians we’ve got – saying to the President “You remind me of me.” Galloway himself had a set-to with some Senators a while ago.
    Incidentally, Galloway is as fierce an opponent of Trump as any on either side of the Atlantic, I should think, but recently tweeted:-
    “Bill and Hillary Clinton and Obama until LAST WEEK murdered a million Muslims. Trump imposed a travel ban. And HE is the No1 villain?”

  178. different clue,
    A lot of people noticed it. I didn’t at the time. I found it more funny than ominous.

  179. Tyler,
    That’s the interview I saw this morning. “Perhaps we need to take it further” is not exactly a ringing endorsement of the possible inclusion of Saudi Arabia. That’s also the interview when Priebus said they couldn’t give any warning of the implementation of the ban in order to prevent terrorists trying to come in ahead of the ban. Well, too late for that. The Saudi Wahhabis have figured that one out already. Trump has screwed the pooch on the surprise implementation plan.

  180. mike says:

    Tyler –
    Haven’t fainted yet! I’ll try to keep my chin up for you.
    Your insistence, and Fred’s, to blame the list on Obama and not on the originators, Rumsfeld/Wolfowitz and congress speaks well for your adherence talking points.
    Do you get a daily fax from Priebus and Bannon?

  181. BraveNewWorld says:

    The Guardian is running a story that the National Security Council with be featuring less military in put and more racist input.

  182. BraveNewWorld says:

    It cost Boeing a $20B dollar airplane deal. So hardly cost free. #MAGA.

  183. Fred, Erich and Tyler,
    Unless Trump is planning an elaborate double-cross worthy of “The Sting,” he seems to have chosen to ally himself with the Saudis. He asked Saudi King Salman for support in setting up his safe zone plan in Syria and Yemen. He’s conning the shit out of someone, either us or the Gulfies.

  184. Eric Newhill says:

    Thx for bringing this to my attention. Obviously, I have no idea. My SWAG is that Trump is conning the Gulfies.
    Based on what?
    1. Trump likes to win…no, that’s not quite it…. He’s driven to win. He needs to win for America because that is the game he is playing at this time. Getting big wins for America is a huge boost to Trump for Trump. Everyone thinks Trump’s narcissism drives to ONLY petty self-serving behaviors because that is how a common narcissist operates. There is nothing common or petty about Trump. Trump’s narcissism is well channeled toward huge achievments. It drives him to accomplish what he said he’d accomplish; which is great improvement for America’s position in the world and for Americans generally. That’s the basis of my theory now and has been all along. Those who think he is a shallow conman are mistaken. He is an extremely complex and hyper-intelligent conman that has somehow, by divine intervention, accident, or twisted personal design, aligned his need to con effectively with the betterment of America.
    2. The Gulfies are worthy adversaries. To beat them is a huge boost to Trump for his ego. The American people are not worthy adversaries. So he will apply the art of the deal to the Gulfies and win for America. He will accomplish what others could not. That is what he MUST do to fulfill his own self-image. Else he is not Trump the Great.
    3. I imagine he harbors some small, but influential, amount of animosity toward the Gulfies lingering from past business dealings. An Arab can’t do business without trying to screw someone and neither can Trump. I’d guess for Trump, he’s back for another round with the Gulfies writ large.
    This is going to be fun to watch.

  185. Eric,
    I like your analysis and sincerely hope you’re right. His ultimate trophy would be a successful presidency and America and I do think he’s smart enough to realize this. I just hope he’s smart enough to pull off this con of a lifetime. Like I said earlier, it’s still early.

  186. kooshy says:

    James, Russia and Iran are only allied very narrowly, due to her geographic location, and her ethnicity Iran can’t and will not ally herself with any outside powers. Because of this reason, and others, throughout history Iran has survived by balancing of powers, actually history of Iran is the proof that they are very good at balancing of powers to survive and further their interests. At time of weakness, they used Brits against Russians, and vice versa, and again americans against Russians. and just now they are using the Russians against americans in Syria. The only real allies Iran has and will protect with blood and money are the Shia , and moderate sunnis that accept shia. Currently Iran and Russia are “allied” on only 2 points one obviously is Syria and the other is to contain US hegemony in ME region, which is almost easy thing to do, this is because US’ own posture with regard to this region, allying herself with all the region’ decorators and Israel, attack and killing muslims in region at will, etc.

  187. Tyler says:

    No mike. Once Obama continued it, it became his policy. He owns it. See also: drone strikes. Sorry boo. Let me know which CTR talking point you’re gonna employ next.

  188. Tyler says:

    I have zero problems with this policy.
    Graham, McCain, Soros, Schumer – all the Borg is shrieking now. And TTG is aligning himself with them.
    So far Trump is off to a good start.

  189. Tyler says:

    The sky is always falling in your world re: Trump. Got it.

  190. kooshy says:

    Just figured out why there are cars in LA with gulf state’ licence plates, like the one i saw yesterday. Here in Los Angeles one hardly sees a car with canadian licence plate never less the Qatar. The reason is, if you want to drive a luxury car while in vacation for a month or longer, is cheaper to ship your luxury car, than renting one for a month, like cars rented by Beverly Hills Rent a Car.

  191. Fred says:

    “There is a virulent dedication to due process…” That’s a fine choice of word: virulent: extremely severe or harmful in its effects. “the believers in due process into action”
    What a condescending piece of divisive hogwash. Side with Origin or be shown to be the enemy of due process! You don’t like Trump? Considered condescension like this is the reason he’s president.

  192. Tyler,
    I follow your logic and it is impeccable. Let us follow it through. Once Trump continued it, it became his policy. All the quibbling about Obama, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz and Bush is moot.

  193. Fred says:

    I don’t know what he’s up to. He certainly made enough “deals” and has made enough money to last generations. The only thing he hasn’t earned enough of is honor. To paraphrase that other minority President, Lincoln, all he has to do to earn that is give “his first full measure of devotion”. He sure isn’t going to be doing that by putting the foreigner first and the people who voted him into office last.

  194. mike says:

    Tyler –
    That dog don’t hunt. The Tea Partiers in Congress continued that policy. Get your facts straight. Oh wait, I get it, you have an inside track to the a-a-alternative facts.
    I should have realized long before this you have an inside line with the new and improved Borg.

  195. Sam Peralta says:

    Trump is trolling McCain & Graham on the immigration issue. Nice!
    “The joint statement of former presidential candidates John McCain & Lindsey Graham is wrong – they are sadly weak on immigration. The two Senators should focus their energies on ISIS, illegal immigration and border security instead of always looking to start World War III.”

  196. rusti says:

    This sounds indistinguishable in my ears from Obama supporters who always insisted that he was playing “Eleven dimensional chess” and everything was part of a brilliant long-game.

  197. Ingolf says:

    Eric, I think you’re exactly right about what’s driving Trump. Doesn’t mean things will turn out well, of course (if anything the odds seem stacked against him, and the US) but he’s unlikely to fail for pedestrian or narrowly self-serving reasons.

  198. chris murphy says:

    You mean like Switzerland?

  199. charly says:

    That plane has IIRC to much Western parts to be sold to states that are embargoed by the West

  200. Tyler says:

    Except that policy is purely an executive branch choice. Try again, little guy.

  201. Tyler says:

    Except he’s been at it a week and those two had 16 years to change it.
    Don’t worry, I’m sure you’ll find something else to menopausal about regarding Trump in the next 8 years, regardless of whether he changes the policy or not.

  202. Tyler says:

    Good gosh, you project any harder you’re gonna be a cinema. The borg because he didn’t add Pakistan and SA right away?
    You re such a disgusting f-cking liar. As if you wouldn’t be menstruating all over the place if he had included SA and Pakistan

  203. Tyler says:

    Let me give you an idea of how you’re coming across right now, real talk, whether you care or not:
    Its like if we were in a rifle company with two or three bad COs in a row, The new skipper gets in, and all you can do is b-tch about how while he’s trying to unf-ck the work of his predecessors, you’re turning every imagined slight in your eyes into a diatribe about how the man is unfit, every chance you get. If I was in your squad, Id think you were a loudmouth with the memory of a gold fish.
    Soldier to soldier, I’m trying to flag you that you’re out of the box and maybe need to sit a round or two out and let the man work versus being as…shrewish as you’ve come across. Seriously. You re absolutely crashing my opinion of you with this petulance considering where we have come from and how much we have to go. I wouldn’t talk to you like this if I didn’t care.

  204. Babak Makkinejad says:

    On your number 1:
    So you have become the Supreme Court of the United States.
    On your number 3: Not my place; a Federal Judge has issued a legal opinion, you, as an Officer of the Law, are obliged to support that until another court overturns it.
    You can have an opinion, but cannot take action on that opinion – it is not your place.

  205. Babak Makkinejad says:

    The Gulfies; i.e. their governments, have never done anything against the United States. Even their support for Jihadists was part of the Western Fortress effort to roll-back the extension of Iranian power.
    You cannot expect Trump, or indeed any US President, to throw them under the bus – they have been good servile governments to that of the United States.
    Furthermore, the United Kingdom and France – among others – make good money among Gulfies. Even Russia has good relations with them.
    I submit to you that the Western Fortress has made its choice among which sects of Islam it prefers; the same sects that are the thought-leaders of Jihadists everywhere. But you cannot save people from the consequences of their own actions.

  206. Babak Makkinejad says:

    One has to start from somewhere.

  207. Babak Makkinejad says:

    Neo-cons want war. They prefer Jihadists to Shia; that much is clear. Why that is so? Simple: Jihadists are like the Chinese of Boxer Rebellion and the Shia are like the Communists. One side was brainless, the other had a brain.

  208. Cee says:

    FB Ali,
    Listened this AM. I was struck by his comments about deals made to bring Iran in from the cold. The same happened with Qaddafi and we know how that turned out. Betrayal.

  209. Tyler says:

    No Babak, don’t run to weaponized autism because you can’t explain how President Trump is outside 8 USC 1182 and the Obama Appointed, Schumer Supported judge is ruling based off her feelz.
    I don’t tell you how your crappy country should function. Let’s not think you can do the same to mine, thanks.

  210. Sam Peralta says:

    An indictment of liberals for this backlash against immigration from the third world.

  211. Tyler,
    I don’t expect you to ever be comfortable with any criticism of your beloved god emperor. I never thought I’d have anything to say about his policy implementations for at least a few months. Didn’t you notice I had nothing to say about his efforts to tighten up immigration, the refugee program and visa control? He campaigned on this and is well within the law. His implementation was ham fisted targeting a handful of children, old mothers and Iraqi interpreters who put their lives on the line for our troops. I found that embarrassingly un-American. And he missed the most important target. If he banned all Saudis and those who traveled to or through Saudi Arabia, I probably would have given him a pass on the ham-handed implementation. So we’re left with a new President who continues an aggressive hostility towards Iran, continues to coddle the Gulfies and even wants to establish safe areas in Yemen and Syria. Only the jihadis have come out in support of that policy and, perhaps, various neocons and R2Pers. I can’t imagine you embrace any of that or would continue to defend those policies.
    I’ll continue to call Trump on things he does that I consider stupid and/or dangerous. You’re just going to have to get used to it. OTOH I look forward to what he plans to do with our relationship with Russia. I think that will have far reaching benefits for the entire world.

  212. Cee says:

    I was searching around regarding immigration and found this. Does anyone know if she has been fired from the State Department?
    Also a guy named Tom Countryman is supposedly an Israeli mole at State. Any info?

  213. Fred says:

    “You cannot expect … to throw them under the bus -”
    Why not, betrayal is an art in the Middle East.

  214. mike says:

    Tyler –
    Thanks for the compliments. You never fail to inspire. Glad you could be here.

  215. Babak Makkinejad says:

    But what are you going to gain? They are good servile governments.

  216. Valissa says:

    Great comment Eric!
    As to your 1st point, I very much agree with your assessment of Trump.
    As to Trump and the Saudis… remember he’s a practical guy, not an ideologue (though he has some big ideas he cares about). Depending on how much business his business empire has done/does with various Saudi clients, and what his own personal history and business instincts tell him… this will all effect how he decides to deal with the Saudis. I do not expect Trump to give them too hard of a time.
    The US always seems to need an enemy. If Trump wants to make deals with Russia on Syria and more, there will have to be another designated enemy for the M-I complex to talk tough about and spend lots of money ramping up against. Will they be satisfied with ISIS/Al-Qaeda as their new enemy focus? Probably not… not BIG enough, not a nation-state. Right now the new enemy focus appears to be Iran. Since this also makes Israel happy, I can see the appeal of it to team Trump (esp. Kushner). Iran is not as big and powerful as Russia or China, therefore easier to bully.
    Trump does not have the power (nor should he have) to reform the entire M-I complex towards his ends… there will need to be give and take. Any attempt at “solutions” to ongoing FP problems will not be easy or pretty.

  217. Tyler says:

    If your criticism wasn’t coming off as being pedantic and mendacious, I wouldn’t have issues with it. But it’s one long nonstop whine with you.
    Take my advice or don’t. Get over the fact Bernie didn’t win, tho, ffs.

  218. Tyler says:

    Womanly snark. Keep it up.

  219. turcopolier says:

    You are cautioned once more against personal attacks. pl

  220. Babak Makkinejad says:

    Well, my crappy country has been around for 2500 years, let us see how long you guys will be around before you destroy yourselves;
    “Mum, I am not loved….”

  221. TonyL says:

    Thanks Col.

  222. different clue says:

    Lee A. Arnold,
    Fine. Let them do just that. They will discover that money is not wealth. We will still have what few underground minerals we have left. We will still have our water resources. We will still have our farm and forest and etc. resources. And we will not have our Federal, State, and local governments stripped of their ability to pass and apply their own ( our own) environmental, safety, wage, etc. laws and regulations . . . because we will not be subject to “suits for lost profits and imputed loss of future profits” by predasitic investor entities taking us to the TPP-designed Secret Korporate Kangaroo Kourts of the so-called ISDS.
    We will be able to monetise our own wealth at modest rates and re-invest our own “money” in our own “rebuilding”. Meanwhile, the TPP Globalonial Plantation-States will in the fullness of time learn the wisdom of Wise Old Indian when he said: ” When the last fish has been pulled from the last river, then the White Man will learn he can’t eat money.”

  223. Tyler,
    You find me pedantic? Fine. But mendacious? You infer I’m a liar. You crossed a line. Unless overruled by Colonel Lang, I’m banning you from commenting on any of my posts. You no longer have to be burdened by reading and responding to any of my future criticisms of Trump or his policies.

  224. turcopolier says:

    I agree with your action. pl

  225. Eric Newhill says:

    Good thoughts. Possibly accurate, IMO.
    Trump has more than once mentioned NoKo as the real threat. They make for a pretty good enemy. Crazy. Nuclear armed. Very foreign/other-ish. No business ties to get messed up. And the bonus that they really are a serious threat that will have to be addressed one of these days. If NoKo + Iran + Jihadis is not completely satisfying, then just maybe China could be tossed into the mix. That should do it.

  226. Joe100 says:

    TTG –
    Good call, and unfortunate as I have found many of Tyler’s substantive posts informative.
    I continue to be concerned (as I have been for years) by the near-impossibility of quiet, thoughtful political discussion – regardless of one’s persecutive.
    Wish it was not so.

  227. mike says:

    TTG –
    Sorry if I brought any of this on by egging Tyler on. He went way too far with his comments towards you.
    But his attacks on me are always good for a laugh. Reminds of the good old days of the dirty dozens. By that I mean the back & forth trading of “Yo-mama-wears-combat-boots” insults, and not the horrendous hollywood flic with Telly Savalas that twisted and denigrated the honor of Soldiers. It has been 56 years since I was a pfc, and I was never very good at the dirty dozens game, but I always appreciated the zingers.

  228. Origin says:

    Actually, some of the people in the military advising Trump are Eagle Scouts. Tillerson is an Eagle Scout and one who helped the BSA navigate the gay scout issue very smoothly.
    I would hope that the principles of the Scout Oath, the Scout Law, the Cadet Honor Code, and the Cadet Prayer do affect those men and women who are trained in them in how they manage their responsibilities and their duty to their countries. http://www.scouting.org/about/annualreports/previousyears/2013/2013_oath_law_mission.aspx
    My experience over the decades in dealing with men and women who have been raised on these values (values, by the way, that are expressed in the Uniform Code of Military Justice) is that the values endure and the people believing in them are effective and valuable people who apply those values throughout their lives.
    Certainly, the military leaders will follow the letter of the law. All military personnel are on oath to protect and defend the Constitution and to follow the lawful orders of the President and their officers according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice.
    I choose to be “naïve” because I believe that these influences do influence the actions of honorable men and women and that the training gained at a very early age in scouting and later during West Point do temper and affect those who experience it for their whole life. If they do not inculcate valuable moral character, then there is no purpose in having groups like the Boy Scouts and the military academies.
    Anyone inculcated with these ideas seemingly must have a problem with leadership that creates a cloud of lies and confusion as a style for governing. Hope men of honor will help to keep our nation on its track.
    Without naïve people who believe in honor, our nation has no hope.
    I will remain naïve and hope my naiveté and belief in good American values will spread the opposition to the nihilists who now seem to be gaining influence within our Polity.

  229. turcopolier says:

    Were you ever in the military? Incredibly naïve. pl

  230. Farooq says:

    Don’t let anyone get under your skin and make you say things in anger that you most probably don’t even mean. Remember, Americans do the right thing once they have tried everything else. This is a great country and not about to destroy itself just because a tiny sliver of people shouts civil war every time they can’t get it their way.

  231. Cold War Zoomie says:

    Hello Mike,
    Next step has been taken…
    “Iraq’s parliament has called on the government to “retaliate” against US President Donald Trump’s ban on Iraqis, and the citizens of six other Muslim majority countries, from entering the US.”
    But this looks like the kicker…
    “The parliamentary vote passes the decision on whether to implement a ban to Iraq’s president, Fouad Massoum, who can either veto the request or send it on to Prime Minister Haidar al-Abadi to make into law. Analysts say this is something Mr Abadi dreads having to do…Two lawmakers said they doubted the ban would be implemented,…”

  232. mike says:

    Cold War Zoomie –
    My bigger concern is Hashd al Shaabi. If they or any other Iraqis that feel insulted by our ban start taking it out on American troops in Iraq then their blood is on the hands of Donald J Trump.
    If Abadi signs the ban and it stops any bloodshed, then good on him.

  233. Sam Peralta says:

    “…their blood is on the hands of Donald J Trump.”
    Spoken like a NeverTrumper!
    The blood is on the hands of Bush/Cheney & Obama/Hillary who expanded the destabilization to Syria & Libya.
    Donald J. Trump did not start any of these wars nor funded Al Qaeda nor created the millions of refugees.

  234. Sam Peralta says:

    Where were you when Obama & Hillary were destabilizing Libya & Syria and creating the chaos & anarchy there by funding & arming Al Qaeda with the resultant refugees & complete destruction of their societies? And what did you do when the Obama administration was blatantly lying about mass surveillance and when DNI Clapper lied under oath? Where was your conscience when Amb. Stevens was murdered while Hillary and Susan were on TV claiming it was because of a YouTube video and not about gun running to feed the beast in Syria?
    Or does your conscience & morality play only apply to your abhorrence for Donald Trump?

  235. Procopius says:

    “reminds me of the person he was running against..”

  236. Cold War Zoomie says:

    Yes, I’m wondering about Hadi Al-Amiri’s reaction to the ban.

  237. mike says:

    Cold War Zoomie –
    I have not seen a comment by al-Amiri yet in English language open source.
    But the new Director of the Iraqi elite Counter-Terrorism Force is POed. This is the guy that has been working closely with the US coalition to liberate Mosul and other areas that were controlled by Daesh. He is quoted as saying:
    “How can we work with US forces in Iraq now if this is what US thinks of us? I have been killing terrorists for 14 years and now they think I am one? I cannot visit my family in the US.”

  238. Your far-distant dream will happen under various scenarios, including under multilateral trade agreements. I agree that those deals should be better on labor & environmental issues.
    But until your utopia comes, the wealthiest people in the U.S. own the underground minerals & agribusinesses, and they’ve been getting control of the water and forest resources. (Trump & the current Republican Congress is planning to sell them even more of your natural patrimony.)
    If the U.S. shuts itself out of trade deals and offers a smaller ROI than global trade does, then those natural resources are going to be plundered for profit by those investors, on their way out of the country. Meanwhile, you are still going to be sued –sued up the wazoo– for lost profits, or, to put it in other terms, they are going to increase the cost of medical insurance, privatize Medicare and Social Security and put you in mortgage and consumer debt. (These are being lined-up, as we write.) All, for no reason than to feed the Wall Street beast. This will happen LONG before everybody realizes that money is not wealth.
    So, you have to start controlling the movement of financial capital into and out of the country, but you don’t have that power. Because you don’t control the Congress, the rich people do. You don’t even control Trump, it looks like his billionaire lobbyist Cabinet (& a couple of dangerous “war of civilizations” crackpots) own him.

  239. Babak Makkinejad says:

    No, but he can end them. Let us see if he does.

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