"The Roman Catholic bishop of Knoxville, Tennessee, urged Democratic nominee Joe Biden to rethink his support of abortion in light of the fact that God is going to judge him.
“A question for Mr. Biden,” Bishop Rick Stika tweeted Sunday. “At your judgement before God, how will you explain changing your position about abortion and how will you explain promoting no limits and allowing all protections removed protecting the most innocent?”
“Will you tell God you supported the ultimate child abuse because of the American] Constitution?” Stika added. “I wonder what God must have asked many leaders throughout the centuries? Government over human rights and the taking of innocent lives. Many Catholics will need to answer this the first of many questions about the poor, the starving etc.”"
"Stika seemed to question the authenticity of Biden’s faith and went so far as to blast his running mate Sen. Kamala Harris (D-CA) as “an anti-Catholic bigot.”
“Don’t understand how Mr. Biden can claim to be a good and faithful Catholic as he denies so much of Church teaching especially on the absolute child abuse and human rights violations of the most innocent, the not yet born,” Stika tweeted, adding, “And he also praises his sidekick who has shown time and time again in senate hearings that she is an anti-Catholic bigot. So sad for this team.”
"In 2019, Father Robert E. Morey of Saint Anthony Catholic Church in Florence, South Carolina, reportedly denied Biden the sacrament of Holy Communion because of his abortion views. As The Daily Wire reported:
“Sadly, this past Sunday, I had to refuse Holy Communion to former Vice President Joe Biden,” Father Robert E. Morey of Saint Anthony Catholic Church told SCNOW. “Holy Communion signifies we are one with God, each other and the Church. Our actions should reflect that. Any public figure who advocates for abortion places himself or herself outside of Church teaching.”
“I will keep Mr. Biden in my prayers,” Morey added."
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The question in this matter is not whether a politician or jurist should separate his or her personal views from the task of formulating law or judging cases. It is clear that they must if we are to have a secular state in the US.
No. What these priests are talking about is the internal responsibility of the clergy to call to account supposed Catholics who want to claim membership in The Body of Christ while simultaneously and publicly defying the teaching of the church. There are quite a few of these, Giuliani, the Cuomos, Biden, etc. To justify this behavior a false category of "flexible" Catholics is created to justify the hypocrisy of political personal commitment to anti-Catholic behavior while claiming to be a devoted child of The Church
Catholicism is not anything like a Chinese restaurant menu in which one choses one item from Column One, two from Column B. Perhaps you might prefer the analogy of a restaurant buffet.
Catholicism is a hierarchical religion. Its body of teaching, what Feinstein call "dogma" is not negotiable in its elements.
To avoid total hypocrisy anyone claiming membership must accept it all and abjure advocacy of anti-Catholic actions or should publicly depart the church.
pl
The hypocrisy is with the Church, which calls out people for their stance on abortion but never for violating the Just War Doctrine. Back in the day, the Vatican even fought a lot of wars, oblivious to the ethics.
May they all depart the Church.
I was raised Catholic, but lapsed in my youth and never returned. It was largely because I knew the Chinese restaurant menu wasn’t really an option if one wanted to claim Catholicism as one’s confessional identity.
Will Biden be lucid enough to know when Divine Judgment has hit him?
Fr. Stika talks of “Government over human rights and the taking of innocent lives..”, but presumably this includes war, especially aggressive wars. But as Shakespeare’s Henry V says “There never was a King, be his cause ne’er so spotless .. can try it out with all unspotted soldiers”. Also the Church specifically says that killing in war under the orders of lawful superiors is not a sin.
Stika seems high selective in his judgements.
The “renewal” must begin in our schools. Parents must be vigilant enough to KNOW what their children are being taught in our schools. Many parents have been and are aware that there is a terrible stranglehold on public education by the very progressive NEA and have, therefore, taken their children out and have home-schooled them or sent them to private or charter schools.
We need a general uprising against the way history, social studies, and even much of English literature is being taught in our public schools. Unfortunately, many of our parents are themselves now uneducated brain washed graduates of public schools. It’s going to be a major effort to change the way we thing about public issues. The colleges and universities must also be changed. Do not provide public funds to schools that allow theories to control content.
I was working the crowd outside a local supermarket this last weekend with a brother Knight as we were collecting donations for the annual Knights of Columbus Tootsie Roll fundraiser and we got to talking politics.
Conversation turned to the upcoming election and presidential preferences. Jason told me that he was a conservative Republican, but he wasn’t voting for Trump. I was taken aback by his comment and said to him, using exactly the words that Bishop Stika used, that Harris is “an anti-Catholic bigot.”
Jason never told me in as many words that he was voting for Team Harris/Biden, but I doubt if he is voting for a third-party candidate, so the Democratic ticket is probably his choice.
I cannot understand how any Catholic who seriously practices his/her faith can vote for Team Harris/Biden. These two and their fellow travelers are going to make life very difficult for people of faith.
From GEN-X , Jay gives a calm explanation of Orthodox doctrine:
Both faith and logic:
https://jaysanalysis.com/2020/10/13/apostate-prophet-vs-jay-dyer-does-god-exist-problem-of-evil/
jack
it must be a “just” war for participation to be without sin.
All
What I object to is politicians claiming to be Catholic while boasting of their disdain for Church teaching. I don’t care if they leave. Let them leave.
ked
You simple ass! Do you really think I will document my editorial opinions for you?
Chinese menu doctrine has infested most “mainline” Churches and – surprise – membership is declining.
I was born into the Episcopal Church; I’m no longer an Episcopalian.
Take a look at this:
https://virtueonline.org/how-kill-church-just-few-easy-steps
Diana,
“Parents must be vigilant enough to KNOW what their children are being taught in our schools.”
One of the side effects of the NEA’s response to Covid is that many parents are seeing via Zoom just what silliness their kids have been getting exposed to for years. The move for vouchers is going to accelerate over the next few years.
I am indeed a simple ass – I mistook your post as an expression of knowledge of existing Church doctrine, not your wish for what that doctrine ought to be. My apologies.
I cannot support your opinion because I have not seen in history good outcomes when the Church attempts rigorous sanction over matters & during events explicitly secular more than spiritual.
ked
These priests are not trying to run America. What they are doing is trying to purge their church of hypocrites who are free to go away and continue as the hypocrites that they are.
Ed Lindgren
Harris is “an anti-Catholic bigot.” ???
Could you please tell me where you came up with this idea/thought.
srw
She is the only politician that I know of who thinks the “Knights of Columbus” is a dangerous organization.
ked,
Opposition to abortion as a grave evil is openly expressed Roman Catholic Church doctrine. The Church is also opposed to in vitro fertilization, the use of condoms and vasectomies. Execution as a form of criminal punishment is also seen as a grave evil. Using any one of these as a single criteria to accept or reject a political candidate’s legislative agenda is not Church doctrine. OTOH, acceptance or toleration of any of these Church teachings does make one a lapsed or fallen Catholic or, as Colonel Lang said, a hypocrite.
TTG
This doesn’t seem very clear. Do you mean that you believe that public advocacy of abortion by a politician as being a woman’s right is compatible with self-portrayal as Catholic?
pl,
A Catholic politician who advocates for the availability of abortion as a legally available option for a woman and the right to privacy for those women cannot claim to be a sinless Catholic. Nor can a politician who advocates for the availability of birth control including condoms or vasectomies make that claim. Certainly one who advocates for the death penalty cannot call himself a sinless Catholic. But I also believe a Catholic politician who does not advocate for the poor and oppressed among us also lives in a state of sin. They can all still be Catholics, but flawed and sin stained Catholics. Fortunately, all us sinners bask in the light of God’s divine mercy. Without that, we’d be worse than screwed. We’d be damned.
In my opinion, to see the Catholic Church as a church for only the doctrinally perfect is an arrogant view. As the saying goes, we are all sinners and we are all children of God. As for politicians, Catholic and otherwise, we’re left to pick among the weevils. for only the doctrinally perfect is an arrogant view. As the saying goes, we are all sinners and we are all children of God. As for politicians, Catholic and otherwise, we’re left to pick among the weevils.
As TTG said, abortion is a grave sin in Catholic moral teaching. The Catholic Church’s position on this has been unequivocal and unyielding. At the same time, given her role in the healing and salvation of souls, the Catholic Church has also had a strong and active role in helping women heal and find forgiveness for their abortion, particularly through the Sacrament of Reconciliation (“Though your sins are like scarlet, I will make them as white as snow. Though they are red like crimson, I will make them as white as wool.” Isa 1:18).
The late Justice Antonin Scalia’s son, Fr. Paul Scalia, says it best: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nKzbZxTMEIA
Catholics and others have also been given real life examples of women who have had an abortion and gone on to lead a lives of Catholic virtue. Most notably, Dorothy Day (Servant of God), who had an abortion at the age of 20 before converting to Catholicism and embracing and defending the Church’s teaching on faith and morals and leading a life in service to Christ. Day’s cause for canonization was advanced by none other than the late John Cardinal O’Connor, one of the greatest pro-life voices in the Catholic Church in America.
The Venerable Fulton Sheen in his audio catechism (1965) mentions a woman he was instructing in faith becoming very upset during discussion of sin and penance. She became angry and hysterical. As Sheen describes it:
Joe Biden needs to publicly condemn abortion, advocate for life, go to the Sacrament of Reconciliation, and spend his days doing works of mercy. Let’s pray for him.
Cal B
My post is altogether about hypocritical politicians who give scandal to the world. It has nothing to do with the possibility of redemption of sinners.
TTG
“to see the Catholic Church as a church for only the doctrinally perfect is an arrogant view.” This has nothing to do with “doctrine” and everything about politicians who give public scandal contributing to a general disdain for Catholic hypocrisy. These politicians are free to repent and seek God’s ever available forgiveness. We are not Calvinists, believing in the immutability of God’s condemnation of sinners, but if the Church has not the will to condemn public scandal, then what is it that we should bother with?
pl,
Your reply to Cal B cleared up the point you are making. Biden’s claim to being a devout Catholic while advocating for the available of legal, safe abortions is hypocritical. Much like Barr’s claim to being a devout Catholic while advocating for more federal executions in hypocritical. Catholic organizations singling out either of these hypocritical Catholics for praise and awards only adds to this hypocrisy.
Thanks, TTG & Col.
I found this link to be useful (maybe only to me) background on the issue. My take-away is that dogma – at least it’s interpretation – changes.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12178868/
Col.,
I know. I just felt the need to highlight the Church’s compassionate role in forgiveness and healing. I believe many women and men have left the faith and are pro-choice and Democrat because they are suffering from a troubled conscience.
Many people have come to the Catholic faith after suffering extreme guilt from their grave past sins and ultimately realizing that ersatz forms of religious redemption and/or Christianity won’t cut it. Only Christ present in the Catholic Sacrament of Reconciliation will work.
I think of the once Jewish atheist abortionist, the late Dr. Bernard Nathanson*, the co-founder of NARAL who performed 60k abortions, including his own child. When Nathanson was asked why he converted to Roman Catholicism, he stated that “no religion matches the special role for forgiveness that is afforded by the Catholic Church.”
*Nathanson is the one behind the coat hanger (re: illegal abortion) meme. After he became pro-life he admitted this was all a lie which he invented to promote the legalization of abortion.
There is no doubt that Col. Lang is correct in condemning pro-abortion Catholic politicians as hypocrites. The corollary is that Catholic bishops are cowards for not protecting their flocks from such hypocrites. Public opposition to politicians who refuse to protect unborn babies would be a minimum. Recourse to excommunication is possible in some cases.
Yet, rarely do we witness episcopal opposition to the those Catholic enablers of abortion. What sustains the perverse relationship between anti-life Catholic politicians and negligent bishops?
Kerry Noonan
As I have written before, most American clergy and hierarchs are careerists, looking for a soft life outside the hard, heterosexual, dog eat dog world. They want the perks that they are given by “friends of the clergy,” the fishing trips, tickets to the ball game, steak dinners at good restaurants, etc. Politicians are often either able to provide such luxuries themselves or have connections to those who do. Not all are like that. I remember a Franciscan I met at the Holy Sepulcher. He had given up a rich parish in Orange County, California, his black silk clerical suits, Gucci loafers and his Mercedes because he felt they were keeping him from following Jesus.
All
I remember Barry Knestout well from EOHS. He was a handmaiden staffy for both Hickey and McCarrick. Now he is bishop of Richmond. Well, well. “It isn’t who you know …”
https://richmond.com/news/state-and-regional/catholic-diocese-of-richmond-paying-6-3-million-to-51-victims-sexually-abused-by-clergy/article_d7cf2355-a7c8-5fd6-a774-c9e9b889f7f2.html?utm_source=RTD&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=Breaking%20News
https://www.complicitclergy.com/2018/08/21/bishop-barry-christopher-knestout/
This saga is perfectly illustrative of my complaints against the Catholic clergy in America. 6.1 million of parishioners’ money. It is nothing to these hypocrites.
TTG wrote:
Biden’s claim to being a devout Catholic while advocating for the available of legal, safe abortions is hypocritical. Much like Barr’s claim to being a devout Catholic while advocating for more federal executions in hypocritical.
This point is very noteworthy. I speculate that the Catholics are loud about abortion because any fertile, sexually active woman might make a personal choice to get an abortion. However, the Catholics are fairly quiet about executions because the public has little to no power over executions. If the Catholics want to minimize executions, they would need to persuade the decision-makers, not the general public.
A separate issue is the problem of human dignity in the context of imprisonment. My theory is that imprisonment is worse than execution, because those who are imprisoned are typically conditioned to accept greater cruelty and then educated in graduate-level criminal skills. Execution kills a bad man before he does more harm. Imprisonment mostly takes slightly bad men and turns them into intensely bad men. To the best of my knowledge, the Catholics don’t have a solution for this.
Diana – defund the Arts Faculties, not the police.
The Humanities Departments should return to the study of the classics in the original ancient languages – Greek & Latin.
This Marxist and other claptrap is going to ruin us all.
Col.,
“He had given up a rich parish in Orange County, California…”
While channel surfing one recent sleepless night I stumbled upon an EWTN broadcast about priests serving in Papua New Guinea. A very impressive group of dedicated men and even more interesting parishioners.
fred
I remember a missionary priest stationed among poor, poor campesinos in L. America preaching at St. Mary’s in Alexandria. He said that the Christian fellowship among his people, the real people of God, was so strong that at the Eucharist he had a hard time seeing when he was giving them Communion if he was the minister or they.
For the Benefit of the Readers,
Nicholas Cafardi, former Dean of Duquesne Law School, and canon law expert, had a piece on canon law on all this over at Commonweal. It appears the good bishop is not altogether familiar with church law. On another note, I was amused to see Judge Barret defend her involvement on a Catholic school board that does not admit children conceived out of wedlock, which overlooks the Lord himself who cold not be admitted into her school. Also, she seems unaware, as probably do most Catholics, that the Immaculate Conception refers to Mary, not our Lord. But then again most Catholics do not call themselves devout.
joefromPittsburgh
I have not heard her call herself “devout.” link for the strange school?
snowflakes came early on The Bluff:
Duquesne University Fires Professor Who Used N-Word 3 Times During Online Class
https://www.post-gazette.com/news/education/2020/10/07/Duquesne-University-race-slur-academic-freedom-AAUP-Gary-Shank-FIRE-teaching-speech/stories/202010070141
jowfrompittsburgh
I found an article on the strange group of schools. Yes, it is an ungenerous policy to exclude illegitimate children, but intended to encourage marriage.
Colonel,
More stuff from Biden.
Joe Biden Says He Supports 8-Year-Olds Changing Gender: ‘I Will Flat Out Just Change The Law’
https://www.informationliberation.com/?id=61816