“Ukraine Launches Unmanned Systems Force as New Military Branch”

Ivan Havrylyuk, Deputy Minister of Defense against the background of the logo of the Unmanned Systems Forces, June 11, 2024

The Armed Forces of Ukraine have introduced a new military branch aimed at supporting and developing units of unmanned systems, according to a report by Militarnyi. Representatives from the Armed Forces and the Ministry of Defense presented the Unmanned Systems Force, a pioneering branch in the world of military organizations on June 11, 2024 in Kyiv. The symbol for this new branch is a swallow.

The Deputy Commander-in-Chief of the Armed Forces, Vadym Sukharevsky, has been appointed as the Commander of the Unmanned Systems Force. During the presentation, he stated that the creation of this new structure is a response to modern battlefield requirements and is based on contemporary military experience. “We showed the whole world today that Ukraine has moved away from a conservative approach. Today we set a precedent. Thus, we are ready to dictate the rules of this war for further success,” stated Sukharevsky.

Ivan Havryliuk, the First Deputy Minister of Defense, added that the new branch will enable further strikes on the enemy at all possible distances, from the front line to the Urals. According to him, Ukraine is the only country in the world that is already completing the establishment of such a branch.

As of today, the Unmanned Systems Forces (USF) are already operating in test mode and will be further improved according to requirements and needs.

Speaking about tasks and functions, Vadym Sukharevsky said that the newly created branch will focus on interaction with existing units of unmanned systems, their support, strengthening and increasing capabilities. “In no way will we remove units from the brigades that are on the front lines today, it will be destructive. We will take on specific tasks and provide support,” said Sukharevsky.

The branch will be tasked with providing units with drones, their support, recruiting and training specialists, as well as planning military operations involving unmanned systems.

In addition, USF will gather experience and interact with manufacturers of unmanned systems. According to the Commander, the new line of troops will focus on cooperation with manufacturers of domestic drones. The branch already maintains contacts with 90% of Ukrainian manufacturers and actively communicates with them.

Sukharevsky noted that today the government has currently contracted and is procuring products from over 125 manufacturers. “The president’s task of producing more than a million FPV drones will be fulfilled and moreover, it will be exceeded. It’s guaranteed.

With regard to the supply and operation of other systems, their provision with all necessary components, there is a certain element here that we have manufacturers who are not ready for large-scale production. The state is working to scale production of the best models. This program, which the state is now launching, will allow for the next year to provide our units with the necessary means,” the Commander added. “The president’s task of producing more than a million FPV drones will be fulfilled and moreover, it will be exceeded. It’s guaranteed.”

https://mil.in.ua/en/news/ukraine-launches-unmanned-systems-force-as-new-military-branch/

Comment: This is good news. It’s no secret that Ukraine started early in developing drone warfare and is ahead of all others. The effort has been decentralized in training, employment and in the manufacturing of drones. This was good for innovation but not so good for moving to the next level in what has become a critical capability in this war. The best drone designs need to be mass produced on a wide scale, not just by a few boutique manufacturers. Local innovations in the use of EW, AI and tactics must be spread quickly across the force. The Unmanned Systems Force should make all this happen. I’m also glad to see the intention is to create and train new drone units without detracting from the drone units already deployed with the combat brigades. 

TTG

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44 Responses to “Ukraine Launches Unmanned Systems Force as New Military Branch”

  1. babelthuap says:

    Russia has knocked out an enormous amount of electrical power in Ukraine. Unfortunately nobody is aware in western media that Ukraine is dealing with rolling blackouts throughout the country not to mention they just got slammed again yesterday with massive strikes. Ukraine is also retreating by and large on the frontline from critical strongholds.

    Anyone saying otherwise is either mentally feeble minded or, they just ignore reality. Oh, and I hate Russia! Can’t stand it but those are the facts. Accept it or do not. I honestly do not care but to keep pushing they have some advantage is pathetic and sad. They do not. I salute them for effort but this war is over. Ukraine will run out of bodies. Gotta have the bodies on the ground to not only fight but to hold the ground. They have neither.

    • TTG says:

      babelthuap,

      Finally going after Ukraine’s electric power infrastructure is the smartest move the Russians made in this war. It definitely beats going for apartment blocks. Ukraine is now starting to hook into the European power grid in response. They’ll need it this winter and to keep their armaments industry going.

      Ukraine, and Russia, have a long way to go before they run out of bodies. Ukraine can’t give up. They see what happened in Bucha, Irpin and many other places the Russians occupied. They see how their prisoners are treated and how their children are stolen. Russia won’t stop because Putin’s legacy is at stake.

      • babelthuap says:

        Like I said, I do not care. Just the facts and the facts right now is a country of over 100M is defeating a country of less than 30M. There is no way around the body count. Ukraine would have to amp up the attrition to something like 1,000 to 1. NEVER GOING TO HAPPEN. Ukraine will get nuked before it even gets anywhere near that ratio.

        These are the facts. Ukraine and whoever else will get nuked if they do not get off that border. It’s not up for debate. The NATO push has ended. This is the dead end. Either stop or a lot of people die. To include me and you. If you think that is funny then we will find out together I guess what level of comedic stylings you can physically handle.

        • TTG says:

          babelthuap,

          So you are convinced that the Kremlin is intent on initiating nuclear war. How about NATO Finland’s 800+ miles of border with Russia? The Finns are so close to Saint Petersburg with their substantial fleet of nuclear capable F/A-18s. Shouldn’t the Russians have initiated their nuclear war already?

          On your mathematical certainty of 100M > 30M, shouldn’t we have turned Afghanistan into a little America on the same mathematical principle?

          • Fred says:

            TTG,

            You jumped on that like a trout to a fly. Finland has zero nuclear weapons and no one is going to give them any. They have one city worth the name and less than 6 million people. No one in the US is going to sign up to save them should their lefty leaders get them into a border war with the Russian Federation.

          • TTG says:

            Fred,

            Finland has no nuclear weapons and wants none stationed there, but they now participate in NATO nuclear planning sessions. Their 60+ F/A-18s (about to upgrade to 60+ F-35s), along with Sweden’s 60+ JAS 39 Grippens can fly escort to other NATO or US nuclear weapons equipped aircraft if the need arises. Both countries are now NATO, not neutral. It’s certainly a bigger potential offensive threat to Russia than the Ukrainian Armed Forces with no nuclear weapons and still no NATO formations or missiles in country. Ukraine remains less of a military threat to Russia than Finland and Sweden have become. Yet Putin got his panties in a wad over a non-NATO Ukraine while now ignoring an 800+ mile increase in his border with NATO. The NATO threat is a bullshit excuse. He just wan’t the Ukrainians back in the fold.

          • Fred says:

            TTG,

            Finland is going to spend two or three billion USD on aircraft to “escort” other planes carrying nuclear weapons? That’s a worse take on strategy since someone pointed out to Curtis Lemay that massed bomber formations could be shot down with air to air missiles with tactical weapons way back in the 50s.

          • TTG says:

            Fred,

            That’s one of several missions for the Finnish AF. Their F/A-18s can launch JASSM-ER long range missiles as will their F-35s. Of course they can also interdict incoming aircraft or missile attacks.

          • Fred says:

            TTG,

            Their two squadrons and whatever F35’s show up s0me year in the future will fly around waiting for US, UK, or French nuclear armed aircraft to fly all the way up to Finland so they can cross the Russian border to launch a strike? Laughable.

    • Fred says:

      Babelthuap,

      It’s apparent that Moscow has zero intention of occupying the country as they would need to rebuild all that infrastructure. It is also apparent that the corporate allies of the borg are salivating at the potential reconstruction contracts. All paid for with other people’s money. Too bad about the dead. The people in the EU leadership who just lost in recent elections don’t care about them either. Certainly the unelected don’t.

  2. Lars says:

    Russia is facing a serious demographic time bomb. A lot more people are dying than being born. I just read a report this morning that Russians are lining up to by US$ by the thousands. Now why would they do that, if everything is just fine? Then there is the reports that many more Russian soldiers are dying than Ukrainian ones. Ukraine is now also targeting Russian air defenses with notable success. Possibly in order to be able to us the F-16s they are starting to obtain. As has been stated, this war is existential for Ukraine and only so for Putin, who has to keep looking over his shoulder at all times, as is common with dictators.

  3. F&L says:

    It’s worth noting that Putin just today made a comprehensive peace offer. He wants the territories occupied and claimed by Russia to be vacated of Ukrainian forces but says nothing at all about Kharkiv or Odessa (or Dniepro, Sumy etc). That should tell you something. It tells me that Eric Newhill’s recent summary is dead on (on an earlier thread). See below copy paste re Putin offer.
    —————-

    https://t.me/logikamarkova/12308
    Putin made huge concessions in his peace proposal. After all, Odessa, Nikolaev, Chernigov, Sumy, Dnieper, Kharkov, these original Russian cities, remain part of Ukraine. Kyiv after all.
    For these huge concessions, Putin will be subject to harsh criticism within the country from radical patriots. But ending the war is worth such concessions.

    • F&L says:

      Tatiana Stanovaya analyzes the Putin peace offer – a thread.
      https://x.com/stanovaya/status/1801594717156560923

    • leith says:

      F&L –

      Putin wants 100% of Donetz and Luhansk Oblasts. Both are rich in industry plus Ukrainian coal and oil deposits. He wants all of Zaporizhzhiya and Kherson Oblasts. Both are agricultural giants plus in Zap there are huge manganese deposits and the NPP. Right now Putin only controls ~50% of Donetz, Zaporizhzhiya & Kherson and perhaps 96% of Luhansk. So it’s not a ceasefire. He want Ukraine to withdraw from territory they currently control, and put millions of the Ukrainian civilian inhabitants at risk of torture, imprisonment or rape if they stay.

      • d74 says:

        ” put millions of the Ukrainian civilian inhabitants at risk of torture, imprisonment or rape if they stay.”

        Your predictions are very balanced.
        I think that Putin will personally give them all the diseases that the newspapers have accused him of over the years. Sweet revenge.

        And what’s more, he will enjoy it. He’ll finally be able to take advantage of the shipwreck that is his disastrous old age. Look at him, pale, covered with smallpox, sickly, hesitant, lost, and oblivious to his surroundings. I’ll stop here. It’s uncharitable to shoot at an ambulance.

        And maybe he’ll be able to prove that a virus is the cause of cancer in general, all his cancers in fact. Not that cancers are his only diseases. That will be his great scientific contribution. I can only imagine the hype of the news media at his beck and call.

        The unfortunate Ukrainians will be sacrificed for the sake of science, as well as perishing under the merciless Russian bear.

        • leith says:

          d74 –

          It’s based not only on what happened in Bucha & Irpin. But also in liberated regions of Kherson, Zaporizhzhia, Kharkiv & Sumy Oblasts, where torture chambers and mass graves were found by the Associated Press, BBC, the Guardian, HRW, the Independent, Reporters w/o Borders, the Times and the UN.

          You’re right that it’s probably not balanced. But then I haven’t found any accounts of torture and mass murder by Ukraine’s AFU or HUR. Despite the hand-wringing here on what the ‘nasty ne0-Nazis’ would have done to Russian speakers in the Donbas if Saint Putin hadn’t invaded. Yes there have been Russian Orthodox priests arrested for spying for the FSB or preaching anti-Ukraine sermons. But arrest is neither torture nor murder. Mobs here tarred and feathered some Anglican clergy in the Revolutionary War. Putin’s forces have murdered two Ukrainian priests and killed two more when shelling churches. They have tortured Evangelicals in Ukraine and hunted them down in Russia. And there was a viral video out there last year or in 2022 that claimed to show a battlefield execution. I couldn’t see any execution on the video.

          For balance, I’m open to suggestions if the sources are third party and not traceable back to Putin’s agitprop wurlitzer.

          • d74 says:

            Leith, I can’t answer that. I’m not an accountant who writes down all my sources of information. It’s a mistake, but I’m too old to change.

            War in itself tempts the weak and unbalanced to criminal acts.
            There are two sides. The important thing is that these crimes are punished by the justice system of the criminals’ country.
            Personally, I was disgusted by the brutal treatment of the 4 perpetrators of the mass crime (155 dead) near Moscow by the Russian security services. It was a mistake. I hope that those responsible will be tried and punished.

            For 9 long years Donbass has been the victim of a military operation called ATO (Anti-Terrorist Operation). Babies, women, old people, all terrorists. In addition to the heavy weapons used against the civilians, the punitive pseudo-regiments had a free hand to punish these civilians: looting, murder, torture, and so on. It leaves its traces.

            In 1945, French troops in Germany captured Frenchmen in SS uniforms, numbering in the hundred (my memory is uncertain). They were shot by order of the general. All witnesses and actors agreed. Unfortunately, US journalists on the prowl or looking for a scoop found out. They started a smear campaign against our best division officer. In France, it fell on deaf ears. Not because of indifference, but because of our approval of the general’s action. The pro-Nazi militias had just committed some 35,000 atrocities during the liberation of the country, and the first deportees with their horror stories were beginning to arrive. This explains why.

            Unfortunately, in war, morality is the fifth wheel. Besides, I’m very suspicious of the power of the press to stage the horror of the enemy’s actions, or simply to tell bullshit by the mile. Putin’s illnesses are a case in point, with plenty of medical consultants to back up this opinion. Consider that for 50 years they’ve been praising the high moral standards of the Izzie Army, while criminal individuals have been complacently filmed committing crimes, especially in Samaria-Judea. Just like the perpetrators in the Donbass. Not to mention that the Izzie forces are committing a mass crime in Gaza, a crime according to French military regulations.

            The entire mainstream Anglophone press is a war machine. All these newspapers and TV lie and invent, sometimes a little, sometimes a lot. They mix the probable with the possible, the certain with the alleged. Their high point was justifying the war in Iraq. Their information in the various wars in the former Yugoslavia has been very unbalanced.

            I’m particularly suspicious of the Guardian.

          • leith says:

            d74 –

            You are right to be suspicious of the Guardian. I’m not fond of them either, perhaps for different reasons than yours. But do you also distrust the reports from Reporters Without Borders (more known as Reporters sans frontières in France where they are based)? Or from the United Nations and Human Rights Watch. Even Le Monde acknowledges mass rapes of Ukrainian women, children (and men) by Russian troops in the occupied zones.

            I also found in Le Monde the report of a video showing Russian POWs being shot in late March. The Prosecutor General of Ukraine said that “investigations and prosecutions would be carried out if the evidence were strong enough.” And Zelenskyy’s Advisor said that “the unlawful treatment of prisoners qualifies as a war crime and should be punished. He also stated that an investigation will be conducted, and the inadmissibility of such actions would be reiterated to defense forces personnel.” Putin on the other hand, for the Bucha Massacre, awarded the commander who participated in those crimes a ‘Hero of the Russian Federation Gold Star medal’.

            As for the ATO, it had nothing to do with babies, women and old folks. The “terrorists” that were targeted were Russian troops and pro-Russian collaborators. It lasted less than four years. In February 2018 it was taken away from the SBU and given to the military and the name changed to the Joint Forces Operation. Did Ukrainian artillery shoot into the so-called Luhansk and Donetsk People’s Republics? Yes they did. But never random attacks against residential areas like the Russian and separatist forces did, and what Putin does now.

      • F&L says:

        Yeah, I get it. Nonetheless if this offer is real then the Ukrainians should take it. Play the percentages.

        • leith says:

          F&L –

          It’s not real. He knows it is DOA. It goes far beyond the plan put out by Xi He only put out the offer to disrupt the Ukraine Peace Summit hosted by Switzerland starting tomorrow the 15th of June. Putin has also been discouraging states and international organizations from participating.

          • Barbara Ann says:

            leith

            It’s as real as a peace summit where one of the belligerents was not even invited.

          • leith says:

            Barbara Ann –

            The Swiss FDFA (Federal Department of Foreign Affairs) stated that they had “always shown openness” to inviting Russia to the first summit; and that Russia had “repeatedly and also publicly” stated that it would not participate in the first summit. The Swiss point of view is that Russia necessarily would have to be involved in the overall peace process eventually, stating, “A peace process without Russia is unthinkable.”

            Putin’s buddy Xi was invited, but declined AFAIK. Putin’s buddies in Hungary and Serbia will be there. As was much of the Global South where Putin has many allies.

          • Barbara Ann says:

            leith

            Always showing openness to doing something is not the same as doing it! Russia was not invited says the NYT. Russia has of course considered Switzerland an “unfriendly” country since she abandoned her long tradition of neutrality and joined the West’s sanctions regime.

            https://www.nytimes.com/2024/06/15/world/europe/ukraine-peace-talks-switzerland-russia.html

          • leith says:

            Why would you invite someone who repeatedly and publicly states they would not participate?

          • leith says:

            The Swiss have a ‘military neutrality’. Meaning no participation in wars; international cooperation but no membership in any military alliance; no provision of troops or weapons to warring parties and no granting of transition rights per the Hague Convention.

            Economic sanctions don’t count for them as breaking their neutrality code. They have a foreign policy and like any other country, neutral or not, they have a right to use soft power against countries carrying out inhumanitarian actions.

            Although I’ve heard some Swiss want to deviate from that in order to provide air defense weapons to Ukraine. We’ll see.

        • Mark Logan says:

          F&L,

          I believe it’s real, and if it is it’s a maximalist opening bargaining position. If the Ukrainians want to engage in negotiations it could well be bargained down somewhat.

          I’m suspect that might be wise. The Ukrainians have to accept some realities. There seems no plausible plan to take back the lost territories. Hoping Russia up and quits is a hope, not a plan. They must accept the possibility Trump wins the election and the US changes sides, if only to the degree of removing all aid. One of his minions managed to stop aid for months and the guy isn’t even in office. Even if Trump loses there could be developments which result in a worst bargaining position than they have now.

          The Euros? There too is a limit on willingness to fund this and limits on how much aid they can provide. The claim that Putin will surely continue? Speculation. There is a distinct possibility Putin, had he allowed himself to believe this would be a terrible fight and not over in a week, would never have done this and regrets it but feels compelled to continue to save face. There is only one way to determine which is true.

          Surely the West will prepare for the worst. Nobody is going to trust Russia for quite some time to come.

  4. Lars says:

    Giving anything to Putin will be a serious mistake. The only thing that matters is that his plans fail. That will get rid of him and allow his soldiers to go home, where they are now needed to grow the economy. This offer, as it is, is just theater and possibly a sign that he knows time is against him.

    • Barbara Ann says:

      Lars

      Please help me out with your logic here; if Putin knows time is against him why would he make a theatrical offer rather than a serious one?

    • Fred says:

      So if Putin dies, just like Czar Elizabeth, Russia will immediately make peace with Zelensky the great?

  5. walrus says:

    You are all deluded one way or another. I blame the schools and the mainstream media for this state of affairs.

    For a start, the words “nuclear capable” with regard to American aircraft have specific meanings and refer to each individual aircraft having a specific set of capabilities that I will not go into.

    If Russia finds itself facing a nuclear capable aircraft flying from a field with known nuclear magazines then that is equivalent to someone pointing a twelve gauge loaded with buckshot at your middle – you dont think twice – you immediately destroy that threat, period, which is exactly what Russia has promised to do,

    The russians have a good idea which aircraft are nuclear capable. Not all are.

    Ukraine ” “winning” – is not and cannot happen strictly on logistics grounds.

    Ukraine mastering drones – correct. War is a learning exercise all credit to Ukraine for trail blazing. However the big dog is China – care to say what their production rates are potentially?

    The moral dimension – we manufactured this whole thing. We are going to wear the result.

    That result may well be nuclear annihilation of western civilisation. We are one mistake away from a nuclear exchange.

    It seems however that US Citizens are too dumb to realise that this is the Cuban Missile Crisis on steroids. Putin isn’t bluffing. He can’t let Ukrain join NATO>

    • leith says:

      Walrus –

      I agree with you that “we are one mistake away from a nuclear exchange“. Let’s hope and pray that mistake is not made. And you are right that China is light years ahead of everyone in drone production. Your argument that Ukraine can’t win because of logistics makes some sense. Unless you consider that some of Putin’s weapon systems seem to be of an inferior quality especially without western technology. Plus he is now purchasing weapons and ammo from NoKo.

      However I have to disagree with some of your other comments. Putin manufactured this, not the West. Potential NATO membership for Ukraine had nothing to do with his invasion and occupation.

      And your argument about nuclear capable aircraft flying from a field with known nuclear magazines is beyond my ken. Are you saying that NATO is going to provoke him into loosing Armageddon? That would be crass stupidity. Nobody here that I’m aware of suggested doing anything remotely like that. And if what you say is true, then why has Putin not already nuked US nukes at Kleine Brogel in Belgium, Büchel in Germany, Aviano and Ghedi in Italy, Volkel in the Netherlands, and Incirlik in Turkey? Those airfields all have nuclear magazines and nuclear capable aircraft take off from them on a regular basis, as well as the nuke capable airfields in Britain and France. NATO has made some dumb-a$$ mistakes, but there is no way they are going to turn Europe into glass. Ditto for Putin who knows that if he pulls the nuclear trigger that Russia will be destroyed as a country. What he will do (if he lasts) is wait for the West to get tired and elect a few useful idiots to shutdown support for Ukraine. That is his only hope.

      • Barbara Ann says:

        leith

        Potential NATO membership for Ukraine had nothing to do with [Putin’s] invasion and occupation

        Lol. That must be why article 1 of the March 29, 2022 draft security guarantees treaty negotiated in Istanbul specifies Ukraine must be a “permanently neutral state” and “non-aligned”. And why point 1 of article 1 in the April version says “Ukraine undertakes to support its permanent neutrality, which is declared and enshrined in the Constitution of Ukraine”. Both are sourced from the English translations published by the NYT.

        https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2024/06/15/world/europe/ukraine-russia-ceasefire-deal.html

        • leith says:

          Barbara Ann –

          Putin’s SMO was on 24 February 2022, which was more than a month before that Istanbul Communique you mention. By the way, that was only a framework of a possible agreement. It was never ratified.

          When Putin launched the 2022 SMO he said it was to protect the LPR and DPR from Nazis, which was a lie. He said his goal was to demilitarize and deNazify Ukraine. He verbally attacked Ukraine’s right to exist and referred to Ukraine as “historically Russian lands”. He claimed there is “no historical basis” for the “idea of Ukrainian people as a nation separate from the Russians”. There was nothing about preventing NATO expansion.

          And let’s go back ten years to February & March 2014 when Putin invaded Crimea and the Donbas. Up until then Ukraine had maintained neutrality. It was only after Putin stole one province and tried to steal two others that the Ukrainian Parliament voted to end neutral status in December 2014. Putin well knew that NATO membership would never be granted while Crimea and portions of the Donbas were under Russian control. He engineered the same type of “frozen conflicts” to block Georgia and Moldova out of NATO and the EU.

          • Barbara Ann says:

            leith

            I’ll let the Fact Cheka take with this one. There are many other examples.

            https://www.reuters.com/fact-check/putin-speech-about-ukraine-joining-nato-predates-invasion-2024-02-29

            If you really think Russia’s #1 demand in the peace treaty negotiations was entirely unrelated to her rationale for launching the invasion I honestly don’t know what to say.

          • leith says:

            Barbara Ann –

            We seem to be arguing

          • leith says:

            Barbara Ann –

            I’ll take the hit for missing that speech of Putin’s threats. But it was 2018 when Ukraine’s parliament voted to enshrine the goal of NATO membership in the Constitution. So what changed in those four years between 2018 and February 2022? What made him invade for a third time? And between his 7 February speech and his 24 February invasion AFAIK there were no moves by NATO to fasttrack Ukraine. Did Macron or any other responsible Western leader or Zelenskyy tell Putin to go fwck himself after his 7 February threats?

            Or maybe no-one in the West responded to his demand of legally binding guarantees that Ukraine would never be admitted? Only waiting two weeks though between the threat and the invasion seems unstatesmanlike on his part. And it’s obvious that the SMO was preplanned and staged long before that 7 February tirade.

            In any case it is a moot point. Putin knows that NATO’S Article 10 that calls for consensus among the Allies (i.e. “unanimous agreement”) would be
            impossible to reach with Hungary and others potentially on his side. Stability is also an
            expectation for participation in NATO’s Membership Action Plan (MAP). MAP aspirants are expected to “settle ethnic disputes or external territorial disputes including irredentist claims or internal jurisdictional disputes by peaceful means.

            TTG – pls forgive my blank post prior to this one. Can’t seem to get sticky keys turned on for this laptop.

    • F&L says:

      walrus,
      You’re right of course. Absolutely. The Western attacks on the Russian nuclear early warning radars are alone proof that this is already more perilous than Cuba. For anyone needing a short refresher course on why see this video interview below. The gist of it is that Russia never had the surveillance and geospatial tech that we have – not nearly. So the recent attacks truly threaten to blind them utterly which is either an announcement that they intend to launch eventually or a sign of the sort of mental abnormality suffered by Hitler and other purely destructive types. Or both. I’m at a loss for words.

      Devastating Escalations between Russia and NATO. MIT Professor Postol.
      https://youtu.be/31evDkl–g0

      • TTG says:

        F&L,

        Ukraine hit that early warning radar with Ukrainian weapons. It was involved in the jamming of GPS signals on the front hindering the effectiveness of Ukrainian missiles and drones. I haven’t heard any Western governments cheering for this attack. In another instance where Ukraine used a Patriot system to ambush Russian aircraft over Russian territory, the US raised holy hell over the matter. We are still reticent about giving Ukraine a free hand to strike military targets on Russian soil. We were shamed by France into allowing as much as we did.

  6. Keith Harbaugh says:

    Walrus,
    I agree with you,
    and I refer all to this excellent 2024-06-14 post from Larry Johnson:
    https://sonar21.com/vladimir-putin-puts-west-on-notice/

    Anybody have any real criticisms of it,
    beyond the usual refusal to recognize Russia’s valid security concerns, over a period of years?

    I think it is way past time to stop tussling with Russia over, God help us, Ukraine.

    • TTG says:

      Keith Harbaugh,

      The best part of that post is in the comment section when a few commenters started arguing about Margaret Mead, Bateson and cybernetics. It was weird and off the wall, but far more interesting Johnson’s tired old trope.

      Russia does have valid security concerns, but so does Ukraine. We’ll see how Ukraine wants those concerns addressed with the peace plan coming out of the Swiss peace conference.

  7. Lars says:

    What seems to be ignored is that NATO is by design a defense organization and thus is not a credible threat to Russia. I can understand that they do not like having capable military close to their borders, if they have aggressive plans and they do. If they pull back, it would not take long for NATO to do the same, since it would save a lot of money. But I doubt that will happen anytime soon, so in the meantime, NATO will ramp up its defenses as long as the threat is there. If Russia is concerned with security matters, they may want to look inward. Any threat to the government may very well be homegrown.

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