“Michigan Republicans find no voter fraud and say Trump claims ludicrous” – TTG

A scene from the current Maricopa audit

An investigation into the Michigan election by state Republican lawmakers has concluded that there is no evidence of widespread fraud and dismissed the need for an Arizona-style forensic audit of the results. The news comes amid a broad push by many Republicans – from Donald Trump to state parties – to push unfounded lies about Joe Biden’s victory, often promoting baseless conspiracy theories and evidence-free accusations of fraud.

The Michigan Republican report released on Wednesday followed 28 hours of legislative hearings starring local and national pro-Trump conspiracy theorists such as former New York mayor Rudy Giuliani. The report labeled many of their claims “ludicrous” and called on the state Democratic attorney general to open investigations into those who may have profited from making false claims.

The report was authored by the Republican-controlled senate oversight committee and it said it found no evidence of dead voters, no precincts with 100% turnout and no evidence of a Detroit ballot dump that benefited Biden, as GOP activists have claimed occurred. (The Guardian)

Comment: This follows a recent “Washington Examiner” retelling of an election analysis of the Maricopa County vote done a few months ago by a Republican election researcher who found that a lot of Republican voters chose the Republican down ballots candidates but refused to vote for Trump. They often voted for Biden instead. In fact “59,800 people did not vote for Trump despite voting for mostly GOP candidates down the ballot. The results of his analysis showed 39,102 of those Republican voters crossed the aisle to cast a vote for then-candidate Joe Biden.” And let’s face it. This certainly wasn’t due to Biden being a charismatic and inspiring candidate.

My gut feeling is that the same thing happened throughout the country. It would explain why Republicans did fairly well last November even though Trump lost by seven million votes. It wasn’t armies of dead voters, bamboo-laced bogus ballots, Italian satellite beams or Chavez’s ghost in the voting machines. Enough Republicans did not want four more years of Trump to make a difference in the election’s outcome.

This sets up a dilemma for the Republican Party. Will they be forced to give Trump another chance in 2024 or will they risk alienating his most rabid followers and try to move beyond Trump.

TTG

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/jun/23/michigan-republicans-no-evidence-voter-fraud-claims-trump

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/arizona-election-analysis-finds-gop-voters-disenchanted-with-trump-helped-biden-win

These two links describe the process used in the earlier Maricopa County ballot analysis and how it could be used with the current election audit to produce something worthwhile. That is if they can get beyond the search for watermarks and bamboo fibers.

votingbooth.media/arizona-analysis-shows-that-many-republicans-did-not-vote-for-trump-in-2020

votingbooth.media/as-arizona-wraps-up-hand-count-of-2020-ballots-new-questions-about-accuracy-arise

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39 Responses to “Michigan Republicans find no voter fraud and say Trump claims ludicrous” – TTG

  1. Sam says:

    In my fearless forecast I am confident that Trump will not win a GOP primary. A guy like Ron DeSantis will crush him. However, a primary with Trump will be a godsend for the failing CNN & MSNBC propagandists who have bled viewers since he exited stage left. Trump kept them in business.

    Trump is a loser. And using his own maxim Americans don’t back losers. Didn’t he say something to that effect about Bomb Bomb McCain?

  2. English Outsider says:

    TTG – there’s still civil war in the Outsider household over this. I’m in the “we wuz robbed” camp and the infants in “It’s a scam” camp. In all honesty I’m going to have to draw your article to their attention but I must say, you’re not helping my cause!

    But there’s been civil war in the Outsider household over a number of matters since 2016. I think by now we’d all feel rather lost without one.

    Whatever the outcome of your election researches I shall continue to drink to the King over the Water. We, that is the UK, seem to be assiduously poking a stick in the Bear’s eye. Looks hellish risky to me, one of our nice new ships doing the tethered goat act in the Black sea for Uncle Sam, and I don’t think it would have happened under a Trump Presidency.

    • Leith says:

      EO –

      I heard that the AIS ship tracking signal of HMS Defender got spoofed. She was nowhere near Russian territorial waters. It is easy to do, and has happened before. The maritime industry has been talking about it for at least a decade; as has also IEEE and various electronics blogs or mags. The spoofer just broadcasts a higher-power signal at the same time and frequency and can then change details of the original message. In the open ocean it is not so easy, but it is effortless in an enclosed sea like the Black.

      • English Outsider says:

        I didn’t know about spoofing AIS. Didn’t in fact know about the system itself, not in any detail. Looked it up and must confess that I’m not a lot the wiser.

        Wiki claims that the ship was spoofed while in port in Odessa. The BBC seems to be saying that HMS Defender sailed within Crimean territorial waters in order to make a point. (“HMS Defender was going to sail within the 12 mile (19km) limit of Crimea’s territorial waters.”) The point presumably being that in our eyes they are Ukrainian territorial waters.

        https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-57583363

        This doesn’t appear to be as serious as the Donald Cook incident, when the ship was reliably reported to have been buzzed by fighter planes and rumoured to have been lit up with anti-ship missile radar. In that case the ship turned round whereas in this the ship held its course. That also indicates this incident was not that serious.

        So was this just another stunt or might it have developed into something worse?

        At least we’re not attempting to force the Kerch strait. Though that might change –

        “Russian state-backed media claims that construction of the bridge caused increases in nutrients and planktons in the waters, attracting large numbers of fish and more than 1,000 of endangered Black Sea bottlenose dolphins.[16] However, Ukraine claims that the acoustic noise and pollution from both the bridge construction and military exercises may actually be killing Black Sea dolphins.[1”

        So perhaps Stoltenberg – that most unlikely looking of military men – might lead us on crusade. “Save the bottlenose dolphin!” There have been more unlikely slogans for men to die for.

        • Leith says:

          EO –

          HMS Defender’s track shown in that BBC link you linked to seems to be just outside the Crimean 12-mile limit. Of course that is hard to say without a chart with better resolution. And perhaps the track shown was a result of spoofing. In any case Defender was certainly within the 24-mile contiguous zone.

          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Territorial_waters#Contiguous_zone

          My question is whether or not Defender was in an internationally recognized shipping lane. Not sure I put much faith in correspondent Jonathan Beale’s comment about being inside 12 miles.

          The bigger question is how the RF Navy will react to the major NATO exercise supposed to start today in the Black Sea.

          • English Outsider says:

            Many thanks for that information. My interest in the matter is in this case parochial. I doubt the Russians or the Americans would risk tangling directly but that might leave plenty of room for knocking the small fry about. Don’t want my nice new ship dented.

    • Barbara Ann says:

      When I read that a BBC correspondent was aboard HMS Tethered Goat I prayed that he not be allowed anywhere near the bridge. That was the cardinal lesson of The Bedford Incident for me.

      • Leith says:

        Barbara Ann –

        The book was not much better but had a different ending. Both were BS imho. Too much comparison of the Bedford skipper with Ahab. But that was apparent in other cold war books and films, i.e. Dr Strangelove, Two Hours to Darkness, and others.

      • English Outsider says:

        “HMS Tethered Goat”. Hmmm.

        As Sir Edward Grey might remark if he were watching today “The goats are being tethered all over Europe” Wonder if the goats themselves are conscious of that.

        • Barbara Ann says:

          EO

          I expect the ship’s company know their status exactly. Perhaps it is the result of an update to the 18th century Admiralty policy that did for Admiral Byng – or to paraphrase Voltaire; “It is good to sink a destroyer from time to time, in order to encourage the others”.

  3. strateshooter says:

    your gut feel that Repubs abandoned Trump but stayed with Repubs down ticket makes no sense to me when he was and still is getting 90%+ approval ratings amongst Republican voters.
    For what its worth ,as an overseas observer , I think you are wrong and that POTUS Trump and his supporters were massively and systematically defrauded on Nov 3rd 2020.
    And irrespective of any feelings towards him THAT is a huge blow for world democracy and freedoms.

    • Christian J. Chuba says:

      90% approval of Republicans but what about Independents?

      The down ballot splitting that TTG talked about likely happened there. Trump and the Republicans did well in 2016 and had no room to grow in 2020. It was a narrow loss, he wouldn’t have to lose that many.
      Even pre-pandemic, the Trump Presidency was overrated, we had record debt and our GDP growth was the same as Obama’s at 2.5% Republicans make it sound like it was the 1950’s again.
      https://www.multpl.com/us-real-gdp-growth-rate/table/by-year
      But oil production was booming, I’ll admit that.

      ———————————————————
      * New topic * NY court suspends Guiliani’s law license http://www.nycourts.gov/courts/ad1/calendar/List_Word/2021/06_Jun/24/PDF/Matter%20of%20Giuliani%20(2021-00506)%20PC.pdf
      ‘knowingly making false and/or misleading statements in court [misconduct]’
      They give examples of statements of fact that Giuliani made in public regarding pending court cases as well as elections in PA, GA, and AZ in their decision. It’s a high threshold and specific to New York state law.

  4. Fred says:

    “This committee exhausted every resource available to it…. However the investigation should not be considered exhaustive. Remaining conscientious of the limitations of this committee, every possible investigaive avenue was not taken.”

    I really like the double speak. “Summary of third party funds….” So nice to issue a conclusive report before you finished the work. Nice job on detroit poll watchers snd that bit about mass mailings of ballots using the wrong data files, which sent thousands of ballots to incorrect addresses or ineligible voters, but if a fraudulent vote by absentee ballot had occurred while the actual voter showed up there would have been problems! No s@#$%.

    What if the same percent of votes were made in that “40% of people eligible didn’t vote ” category as you discovered in your “random” sample (item 2), what percentage of total votes in Michigan, which would be ineligible, would that be, more than 1% of the 8 million registered. Thats a lot of votes. Naw, we were non-exhaustively exhaustive in our efforts, except for that nursing home thing and that poll watcher thing in Detroit, ya know that city controlled by that party that ain’t ours and, well I’m exhausted and I only got to page 12, and only to the part where it becomes clear some senators are spineless hacks who listen to congressman McCarthy’s roomate/mansion landlord’s wisdom.

    • Deap says:

      Antrim County, Michigan forensic audit declared the election in that county should never have been certified, after uncovering numerous irregularities and fundamental election integrity deficiencies.

      Perhaps the GOP committee did not have access to this one Michigan county’s thorough investigation, since they make no mention of it.

      This sounds like Georgia several post-election “recounts’ of the same phony ballot data, that they used to justify their own initial conclusions there was no fraud to be found either. .

      Thank you again, good folks of Arizona, for transparently demonstrating the minimal standards necessary for any recount or post-election audit. And this is said without having any knowledge of what they found – it is the process that needs deep scrutiny, if we want to avoid future challenges to election outcomes.

  5. fakebot says:

    Trump was too reckless, shot too much from the hip. He couldn’t help himself and that led Matt Drudge and Roger Ailes to realize that there was no point coaching him. Drudge completed turned on Trump.

    There might not have been widespread voter fraud, but it was rigged through the media with their over the top negative coverage of Trump and in how the political establishment allowed more mail-in ballots. On average more Americans identify as Democrats compared to Republicans, so that gave the Dems an edge on the mail-ins.

    Trump was in the driver seat though, if he carried himself with more decency and empathy he would not have turned off the voters he needed and he could have won the public over as a victim of political and media sabotage. He simply wasn’t decent and empathetic enough to do that.

    The one good thing he did was show was no one running for president should fear negative press and that you can win if the establishment closes ranks against you. It’s just a question of fighting for it. Trump fought for it, Sanders didn’t.

    • Fred says:

      “On average more Americans identify as Democrats….”

      Do they enjoy $4 gas, government lockdown orders, and being told they are racists whose ancestors founded a racist country too? On a related note I am really impressed with the decency and empathy of the BLM/Antifa movements and the politcians backing them.

    • Deap says:

      fakebot writes: ……….”Trump was too reckless, shot too much from the hip. He couldn’t help himself and that led Matt Drudge and Roger Ailes to realize that there was no point coaching him. Drudge completed turned on Trump……….”

      True that fakebot, but since the only other option was Biden-Harris, your argument is undermined. Real GOP knew to hold their nose and still vote for Trump considering the alternative, which has come to wrought (rot).

      • fakebot says:

        The election was swayed by independents influenced by negative coverage and the greater volume of Democrats owing to mail-ins. Trump himself won over Rust Belt Democrats in 2016. Biden won those votes back. That’s where Trump lost the election.

        • Deap says:

          Trump also lost some evangelicals after his first shout-down debate, particularly if they had early access to mail in ballots at that time.

          Which can also explain the down ticket GOP but either a no vote or a Biden vote at the time. Trump pulled out that first debate disaster later, but not for those who had already cast early mail in votes.

          But voter demographics data should be able to provide clearer answers on these details, but Trump also picked up a lot of new voters too over 2016. Like me.

  6. TV says:

    No surprise.
    There very likely was significant fraud, but not enough to elect Biden.
    For that, they needed the suburban whiney, wine-drinking white women and their squish husbands.

    • Jose says:

      This the line being pushed by the DNC Media and Rhinos United…

      Narrative will change soon enough to massive fraud and fraudulent election but, no remedy for the steal.

      Remember, patience is a virtue.

    • Fred says:

      Which members of the Senate won, lost, or were forced into runoff elections due to that fraud?

  7. Eric Newhill says:

    Who cares what the Rs of MI say? They’re politicians. So we know there’s a high probability they’re lying. They’re talking aren’t they.

    So some back room deal gets made and the Rs part of the agreement is to publicly say “Nothing to see here folks”. What do they have to lose? The election was never going to be reversed. Trump was never going to run again. They learned whatever they learned about the cheating (which was big enough to get senile Joe elected). DeSantis will run in 2024 and mop the floor with whatever radical degenerate the Ds prop up. The Rs will take measures to minimize the cheating in that one.

    The statement is a big nothing burger, as they say, in terms of reflecting reality and the Left’s focus on it a mediocre, at best, attempt to demoralize patriots.

    • Deap says:

      Anyone in elected office during the 2020 election is charged with official oversight of government operation – will any of the GOP officials admit they ran one lousy election?

      If the net result is exposing the zillions of conflicts on interests in any government operation, since they are all run by human beings, then there will be a positive in this public pantsing and exposure of human frailties.

      Less government will be crazy and vulnerable – but more government is even worse.

      • Eric Newhill says:

        Deep,
        Exactly. All snots from the same nose; left nostril, right nostril is a distinction without meaning. And their machine didn’t like Trump because he wasn’t a machine guy. But what Trump jumped off can’t be stopped. They will try to ignore it or, worse, threaten it in ever more maniacal ways which, in turn, will make it stronger and more of a peril to the cancerous nose.

  8. Oilman2 says:

    Watch Texas mis amigos. The center (DC & Feds) are not holding. Each edict and speech is illustrative of how out of touch they are. They are all, each and every one, lining their pockets as fast as they can with stimulus money and raking stock profits like banshees…

    There is no going back to the Trump or Obammy days now, and removing Aunt Jemima and Uncle Ben from a box is more in line with what they are doing to help Americans.

    Watch Texas.

    • Deap says:

      Build that Wall, Texas. Show us how it is done when states take over after federal malfeasance dysfunction. Good reminder – the states originally created the federal government; not the other way around.

  9. LondonBob says:

    Sorry but we have hundreds of examples of dead people requesting and sending in postal ballots in Michigan, tip of the iceberg. We also have the statistically impossible voter dumps where all the votes went to Biden, often without voting down ballot.

  10. Keith Harbaugh says:

    This is remarkable:

    By just about any measure, [the companies that make voting machines]
    are some of the murkiest and inscrutable firms in the civilian private sector.

    Relative to their importance to society, few technology sectors are less well-understood than the voting systems market in the U.S.
    It is an industry funded entirely by taxpayers, and administered mostly by private equity,
    on whose work democracy completely depends—and which even committed analysts have struggled to understand.
    Last year on Capitol Hill, when CEOs from each of the three major voting companies testified before Congress, then-Rep. Susan Davis, a Democrat from California, asked each of them if they could share their annual profits.
    All three declined. As one CEO, Tom Burt of ES&S, politely explained,
    “Congresswoman, we’re a private company, so we’ll keep that information private.”

    [In 2017] Lee Bollinger, the president of Columbia University, co-chaired a commission by the National Academies of Sciences to study reforms to America’s election system.
    “The discussion about voting machines was fairly striking to me,” Bollinger said, recalling the early sessions in which he first grappled with the private industry.
    “I could tell from the beginning—and this may not be an entirely appropriate metaphor—but the kind of ‘black box’ quality to this whole arena was a mystery to me. A puzzle.”

    https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2021/06/25/voting-machines-costs-election-technology-democracy-matthew-caulfield-483080

    • TTG says:

      It was even worse in the past when electronic voting with no paper trail seemed to be the wave of the future. Do you remember the CEO of Diebold sending a fundraising letter to Republicans in 2003 saying “I am committed to helping Ohio deliver its electoral votes to the president.” That raised quite the stink at the time. That was for Dubya’s reelection.

    • Keith Harbaugh says:

      The Politico article focuses on economic aspects of the voting machine business.
      But I wonder about the integrity aspect of the machines.
      Just as when you buy a smartphone, you have to wonder if the manufacturer hasn’t loaded some kind of spyware into the phone so he can make more money off of you,
      so too should we worry that voting machine manufacturers might have made their machines tamperable, either for their own {or their owner’s own} ideological/political reasons, or because they have been bribed to do so.
      So much money {billions!) flows into politics to influence elections, why not influence elections this way?

      There needs to be some way of ensuring the machines themselves aren’t tampering with elections.
      I checked this website
      https://www.cisa.gov/election-security ,
      but they seem more concerned about misinformation and disinformation than voting machines.
      (Maybe I missed something.)

      Various officials have claimed the 2020 election was “the most secure ever”.
      https://www.cisa.gov/news/2020/11/12/joint-statement-elections-infrastructure-government-coordinating-council-election
      “When you have questions, turn to elections officials as trusted voices as they administer elections.”
      Well of course they do.
      But are local officials competent themselves to evaluate the integrity of their machines?
      Administering elections and evaluating machine integrity require quite different skill sets.

      Scorecard, Hammer, Frankfurt raids, and Hugo Chavez may all be red herrings.
      But that doesn’t prove that the machines are on the up-and-up.
      We need something that does.
      Think Underwriters Laboratories for voting machines.
      Or some government version thereof.

      • TTG says:

        The answer is no form of electronic voting relying totally on the output of voting machines. Paper ballots are the gold standard allowing hand counting checks on machine output and 100% hand counting if there is any question.

        Texas, Louisiana, Tennessee, Mississippi, Kansas, Indiana, Kentucky and New Jersey still used at least some paperless electronic voting machines in 2020. Hopefully that is changing fast.

      • Barbara Ann says:

        Keith Harbaugh

        Let me put your mind at ease; if you use a smart phone you are definitely being spied on. I’ve never owned one and use an open source OS on my laptop and still assume I am spied on. “Intel inside” is most likely true in more than one sense.

        “There needs to be some way of ensuring the machines themselves aren’t tampering with elections.”

        There is; destroy them all and revert to paper ballots across the board. In-person voting with paper ballots. “Voting” and “machine” are words that should never meet – very much like “artificial” and “intelligence”.

  11. Deap says:

    State by state -what is happening in each 2020 election still under review: https://redstate.com/stu-in-sd/2021/06/25/a-u-d-i-t-of-elections-is-the-dam-breaking-n401670

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